Some things to think about if you ever consider going to a "rattlesnake roundup"

[Android raptor]

This practice truly makes me sick to my stomache.

The sad truth

This is an example of what I like to call "animal slavery" or "let's have fun butchering innocent wildlife!". Really, if we were doing the same thing to a cute, furry animal (i.e. wolves, rabbits, bobcats) would you feel the same way?

[Tenshi no Ai]

... I like snakes v_v (and that's all I'm going to add to the issue).

[Mangafanatic]

I'm not inherently against this discussion, but I must state very firmly that if this thread turns into a blood bath "friends of the animals vs. hunters" battle, this thread will be locked and those who cause such flame wars will be confronted concerning their behavior. Thanks.

*Osaka rides off into the sunset with her trusty water gun at her side*

[MPX42]

That's all I'm saying,since I never been to a rattlesnake roundup.

[Arnobius]

This practice truly makes me sick to my stomache.

The sad truth

This is an example of what I like to call "animal slavery" or "let's have fun butchering innocent wildlife!". Really, if we were doing the same thing to a cute, furry animal (i.e. wolves, rabbits, bobcats) would you feel the same way?

I'd say I'd want both sides of the story. I don't doubt the Humane Society's sincerity, but on deeply emotional issues I'd like to see their claims backed up by an impartial source before I take this at face value. This article shows appeals to emotion over reason and seems to set up "straw man" arguments for their opponents. Also the fallacy of begging the question by asserting as proven that the promoters statistics are false.

The assertions may well be... but it needs to be proven.

[Steeltemplar]

As it is described there on the site, it does indeed sound as if it has some unfortunate aspects. I would not participate. Of course, this site does not seem terribly impartial. It is possible that it might be a misrepresentation.

Rattlesnakes do present a hazard in areas where they live. I have family in Wyoming and I understand that there they kill rattlers on sight. It is understandable, I think. They present a danger, especially to children.

The "round-up" idea which seems aimed at the extermination of the species from the area may not be so good, though. The snakes are a part of the food chain after all. I am certain that their extermination would increase the population of the rats and such which they probably feed on.

[silver1ightning]

I don't exactly see whats fun about taking down snakes in the first place, thats what I have punching bags and video games and ripping up homework for.

But as AH said, I'd rather hear both sides to a story before making judgement on something I've never done. I hate snakes, but I don't feel like going after them.

[Android raptor]

Yeah, but they've had some things on the Discovery Channel and such about it, and it still makes me sick. Snakes are animals just like cats or dogs; in fact (I need to get the statistics on this) I'm pretty sure that more people die of vicious dog attacks in the US than snakebite. I'll look that up...

EDIT: Just looked it up, numbers are about the same (12 people a year) though it seems far more people are bitten (seriously, I think) by dogs then by snakes.

EDIT Again: It appears dogs are a bigger threat to children than snakes. Dog bites...
I believe the number of people bitten each year in the US by venomous snakes is 1000-something; more than half those bites are not serious (so I've read). Not to say dogs are bad (I think a dog being dangerous is a combination of breed and treatment), but just something to think about...

[Steeltemplar]

Yeah, but they've had some things on the Discovery Channel and such about it, and it still makes me sick. Snakes are animals just like cats or dogs]Dog bites...[/URL]
I believe the number of people bitten each year in the US by venomous snakes is 1000-something; more than half those bites are not serious (so I've read). Not to say dogs are bad (I think a dog being dangerous is a combination of breed and treatment), but just something to think about...

I think that looking at it by pure numbers is misleading.

For one thing, there are probably far more dogs in human populated areas than there are snakes. The statistic does not account for this.

Another aspect is that the statistics don't show what effect killing snakes has had upon the frequency of bites. It is possible that many bites are prevented.

Certainly dogs can be a danger to children, though. That is not something I would ever dispute. But the fact that they can be dangerous does not make snakes any less so.

As I stated above, if the article is correct, than I would not agree with the practice. So we agree there. If I were a farmer or rancher in Wyoming, though, and I found a venomous snakes on my land I might kill it to protect my family. I think that is a reasonable balance. There is no need to actively seek to destroy the population of rattlesnakes or any other snake, especially as they are an important part of the food chain. But where they do invade human spaces, I think it is not inappropriate to use lethal force in defending against the threat.

Of course, when dealing with dangerous snakes, calling the local animal control authority is a good option as well if it is feasible. In some cases I can see it not being the case, however.

[Android raptor]

Maybe it's because of my love for snakes, maybe it's because of seeing the excellent Miyazaki film "Nausicaa of th Valley of the Wind", but I live by the moral of "it hasn't done anything wrong". Now, I definatly do NOT want a flame war breaking out, but pretty much all herpetologists agree that if you see a venomous snake in your yard, do not, under any circumstances, try to touch it, move it, kill it, etc... that's how alot of people get bitten. From what I've heard, the best thing to do is to call Animal Control (or an animal removal service). If it's outside, put a garbage can (or something similar) over it until they arrive. If it's inside, and you know what room it's in, evacuate the room, close the doors, and stuff towels under the doors to keep it from escaping. If you don't know what room it's in, I think getting out of the house is the best option, and doing the same thing with the towels. That's just my advice, though...

[Arnobius]

Well, I think safety of family members comes first (so however it can be dealt with without danger even if it means killing it), but if it's somewhere out in a field or something, it's best to just get back and don't fool around with it, as they generally want to get away. The danger is suprising one, poking around under rocks or junk that it uses as shade. Rattlers are good at getting rid of vermin like rats.

I do know that nests can be dangerous as the adults can become extremely aggressive around them. If it's in the middle of nowhere, I suppose it can be left alone, but if it's on property, it can be very dangerous to the people who live there and has to be removed.

[Mithrandir]

Hmm... I guess if people are actually torturing the snakes, that's not good - there's a moral issue at stake.

But I guess I don't feel the same way you do. I kinda see rattlers like I see mosquitos. I don't feel bad to see them killed.

[Steeltemplar]

Maybe it's because of my love for snakes, maybe it's because of seeing the excellent Miyazaki film "Nausicaa of th Valley of the Wind", but I live by the moral of "it hasn't done anything wrong". Now, I definatly do NOT want a flame war breaking out, but pretty much all herpetologists agree that if you see a venomous snake in your yard, do not, under any circumstances, try to touch it, move it, kill it, etc... that's how alot of people get bitten. From what I've heard, the best thing to do is to call Animal Control (or an animal removal service). If it's outside, put a garbage can (or something similar) over it until they arrive. If it's inside, and you know what room it's in, evacuate the room, close the doors, and stuff towels under the doors to keep it from escaping. If you don't know what room it's in, I think getting out of the house is the best option, and doing the same thing with the towels. That's just my advice, though...

Well, Animal Control is a good option (as I said) and if you live in the city I would totally agree that it is not safe to deal with a snake yourself.

Using Wyoming as an example again, though, I understand they often use a gun for the job. Although I have heard of using a shovel to do it. I don't know about the safety ramifications involved there. Although I should say that I generally trust these farmers and ranchers to know what they're doing in these matters. They make their living in these places and I should imagine they have some knowledge about the local wildlife.

A city-living computer geek like me, though, had better clear the room and call Animal Control

[Radical Dreamer]

I wouldn't dare go hunting for rattlesnakes. That's like asking a bee to sting you. XD I'll stay far away from the snakes, as long as they stay far away from me. *nodnod*

[dragonshimmer]

Hahaha. Only here in South Georgia would they do something like this. Which they just did about an hour from here a couple of weeks ago. "Hey Jim Bob, let's go huntin for them thar poisonus thangs, cuz we ain't go no smarts to do any better." I have the right to say that, I grew up here.

I'm not fond of rattlesnakes, and while they are rampant in the backwoods around here, I don't think it particularly right to go hunting for them and kill them, but that's generally not what happens at the local roundup. They DO antagonize the poor snakes out of hiding, but they leave them be at the end, for the most part.

[Debitt]

While I can understand one's motives for killing a rattlesnake if you encounter one (especially if someone's safety was at risk), I don't think it's particularly smart nor fair on the snakes to go hunting for them just for the sake of capturing them for sport.

Like AH mentioned, it's best just to leave the snake be or call animal control if it's somewhere it doesn't belong. =/ Self defense is the only reason snakes have to attack people, after all.

[Dante]

I saw a rattler once... Yeah only once and I live in Arizona, (but I live in the uber massive city of Phoenix, whose borders know no end, and whose housing development will grow till the end of time, while people move in by the busload and the water levels drop by the day.)

It is interesting to note though, that the last statistic that I heard stated that a rattler would only bite once out of twenty times when stepped on. During my one singular encounter we were out in the dessert for a college astronomy lab, I was thirteen at the time and greatly enjoyed the site. But what is interesting was the contact. Because it was an astronomy lab, all of the lights were turned off, so the first contact with the snake occured when someone went to leave and the snake happened to see them (smell them?). We found out by the rattling sound that scared everyone half to death (we were way out in the dessert, no wheres near a hospital).

What was everyone's responce? LET'S GO CHECK OUT THE RARE ENDANGERED SPECIES KNOWN AS THE RATTLESNAKE! All ten of us went out with our flashlites now turned on and went to go observe the spectacle. So here is the situation, ten human beings standing around staring in awe at a curled up (VERY CONFUSED) rattler, tail a wagging! But people are never content are they, to drive the situation in a rather odd direction, one of the brats decided it would interesting to pick up rocks and launch them at the snake, much to the snakes displeasure I might add. The rest of us were just happy looking at the snake, and while no one agreed with the ill-wills of the individual, we all concluded that the snake could quite take care of itself (It was already curled up and they can LAUNCH)! So we gave the man his distance and let him continue (I have to admit silently cheering the snake, I mean he had no right doing what he was). Be that as it may, I must add further cheers to the animal, for after several stones came hurling it's way, it did not choose give the jerk the wet pants he deserved (one faked spring would have done it, really these guy are all tough on the outside but I doubt it would last half an instant after that snake uncurled, and teeth tapped the skin for just an instant). Instead, it just uncurled itself time and time again and gave the man more distance before eventually crawling away into the night.

Personally though, I do wonder what went through the snakes mind before the more picked up the stones. Here it was minding it's own bussiness when several bumbling humans come along, it gives off it presense warns of it deadlyness and... the reaction... eight more humans come along with bright lights to flash in it's eyes and stare (myself among them). I will note that while the one man did throw stones they were not large or thrown with great strength, but small and tossed... just enough to annoy the animal.

[Slater]

yeah, I saw a beautiful rattler once... we almost ran it over. Here's a pic of her. http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/8274/dscf00146ul.jpg

While I am all for pest control, I think that going out to hunt and torture these animals for fun is just wrong.

[Icarus]

I went to a couple when I was little. Interesting site.