Gambling?

[Alice]

Just wondering if there's anything in the Bible against gambling.

I don't think it's a good thing... But I have played poker (for no money), and I don't think that's bad.

Wondered if there was anything specific in the Bible, or if it falls under the catagory of "lawful, but not profitable."

(If this is too controversial, you can lock it. )

[Slater]

I'm pretty sure the Bible talks against gambling... actually, I have a related question but I'll make a new thread for that.

[~Natsumi Lam~]

The bible does not have a verse against gambling specifically. The bible only mentions "casting of lots" and it is not mentioned negatively[sin wise]. How the Church usually gives you crap about it is that they take the verse " Everything in moderation" and twist it to make it look like you cant gamble because ' you are using the money God gave you unwisely'. Personally, I have had a church that made you feel bad if you go gamble... but when people said to me... " soo you are going to Harrah's [negative tone]", i would say... "i am and it is going to be fun!" And then i said to them, "You are purposely spouting "Christianese" doctrin[sp] , do you even know where you are getting your facts from, cuz i know its not a verse. And, it is my money, not yours , so you do as you will with yours and i do with mine as i see fit. I am not breaking the law so Good day."

But i personally think that if: 1. your government allows it 2.You have no personal conviction 3. And you have money that is not needed for your bills [Ie you gamble instead of going to Disneyland or somethin] -----> have a great time and hope you win some money.

I consider gambling much like smoking and tattoos... if you choose to do it, it is your choice.[Make sure you have no personal conviction though or doing it out of rebellion]. Yes, i know the verse .. "your body is a temple of God"... but that verse is also widely twisted by the church ...."you cant get tattoos because you are messing up the temple, and so on" What people fail to do is know what the verse was intended for. WHen people start taking verses and making it into their own meanings... that is where the negative form of christianese comes it. And this is part of the reason why a lot of non-christians think we are crazy and taking it too far.


~NL~

[Slater]

actually, the reason why the Church is against gambling is because those who gamble are making a sacrafice to (in a sense) worship Lady Luck. If Luck is in their favor, then they'll recieve the blessing of money. If not, they you lose it.

Also, gambling tears families apart all too often. It actually becomes an adiction that's very hard to break for some. I remember my dad once telling me that his gambling got so bad at one point he couldn't get home one night cause he gambled too much money away and couldn't pay the toll to cross the bridge.

So it is true that in many cases that it's better just to save the money and put it in the offering basket. Of course, there are those nickle poker/slot machines that are a lot of fun to play and I doubt someone would break their bank on it, so yes there definitly are ways to gamble and have a lot of fun with low risk (and sometimes a big payoff... my dad won 50 dollars on a 2 cent poker machine a few months ago). But very few are able to make livings off of it like those poker players you see on TV who make like $100,000 every couple day.

It definitly is a hard topic and a hard thing to decide on, which is why for many it would be a good idea to err on the side of not gambling. Still, there is no verse that comes to mind that is against gambling... just Biblical principles.

[Mr. Rogers]

"And, it is my money, not yours , so you do as you will with yours and i do with mine as i see fit. I am not breaking the law so Good day."~NL~

Actually...it's God's money...not yours.

you could throw away $500 gambling, or you could use it to send bibles to Asia or Africa (where there is often one bible per church)...i don't think the choice is very hard there. money is a gift from God, there are many people who don't even make $200 a year. don't waste your money gambling it away. It doesn't matter what personal feelings about it are - things are either right or wrong, whether we agree with that or not.

[Slater]

Ja. And I mean, if you play just for the thrill factor, why not just play for play money or for crayons or something? That's what my family does.

[ShiroiHikari]

If gambling is a sin, then wouldn't arcade games be a sin too? I mean, it's basically the same thing...you throw your money into a machine and don't really get it back.

I think gambling is probably not a good idea, but I don't think it's a sin.

[Slater]

a good point you bring up. It's for that reason that I don't like to play arcade games unless someone's paying for me. I mean, where there's an arcade, there's usually a perfectly good vending machine selling yummy Big-Kat bars.

[~Natsumi Lam~]

actually, the reason why the Church is against gambling is because those who gamble are making a sacrafice to (in a sense) worship Lady Luck. If Luck is in their favor, then they'll recieve the blessing of money. If not, they you lose it.

thats the problem... the church's thinking... each person answers for their choices. So, a church can incourage wisdom... but many churchs[i know personally] make a blanket under lieing statement that "God says NO" in all cases.

Also, gambling tears families apart all too often. It actually becomes an adiction that's very hard to break for some. I remember my dad once telling me that his gambling got so bad at one point he couldn't get home one night cause he gambled too much money away and couldn't pay the toll to cross the bridge.

This is where the first says "In moderation", and says " Live by wisdom". Thats why i said personal conviction comes in. When your gambling becomes an obsession, and goes past moderation.. then sin comes in -> "which leads to death".

So it is true that in many cases that it's better just to save the money and put it in the offering basket.

The problem i was saying about the Church is that they consider this point but they add a little guilt trip at the end like it is a sin. The church could one day take it too far and say " no Ben and Jerry's ... your money should go to offering". My parents went to a church like this before. It is all about you and your relationsip with Jesus... not the Church and you and Jesus. Tithes are manditory [which the church does wrongly... it should be on the 7 year biblical cycle], and offerings are how God leads.

Of course, there are those nickle poker/slot machines that are a lot of fun to play and I doubt someone would break their bank on it, so yes there definitly are ways to gamble and have a lot of fun with low risk (and sometimes a big payoff... my dad won 50 dollars on a 2 cent poker machine a few months ago).

I agree.... this is what i do when i gamble at Ak Chin.

But very few are able to make livings off of it like those poker players you see on TV who make like $100,000 every couple day.

Yea i agree... we are not supposed to live off it... because that would not be gambling in moderation. So, wisdom kicks our butts if we do that, so does our checkbook.

It definitly is a hard topic and a hard thing to decide on, which is why for many it would be a good idea to err on the side of not gambling. Still, there is no verse that comes to mind that is against gambling... just Biblical principles.

I think it is easy.. kinda like deciding what socks to wear.

here is how i do it:
Is there a verse against it: ----> nope
Do i feel the HS convicting me that i shouldnt do it? ---> nope
Am i doing it for any negative reason:-----> nope
Is it against the government: --> nope [govern said there are spec. gamb spots]
Am i doing anything unwise: ---> nope [unless using money for bills or tthe or so on].

== all nos so it is good to go.

In the end we answer to God ... not the Church. So it is all about personal conviction and wisdom.

~NL~

[Mr. SmartyPants]

If gambling is a sin, then wouldn't arcade games be a sin too? I mean, it's basically the same thing...you throw your money into a machine and don't really get it back.

I think gambling is probably not a good idea, but I don't think it's a sin.

I do not really know my own personal stance on the issue

however it can be argued that when gambling, you do it so you could try to win more money... nobody will pay to play poker when they know they are not going to win money. Greed goes into the whole factor of gambling

and just because you do not feel convicted doesn't make it right. I mean you got people who do drugs and do other bad things and do they feel convicted? not really

[~Natsumi Lam~]

Actually...it's God's money...not yours.

again "Christianese": i was making a point.. of course everyone can come up with some wonderful biblical retort to almost everything. He gave you the money to use wisely. Then you could say... oh i am Gods and he owns everything. I cant eat anything that might be over the top, i better sstick to manna. He requires the 10% from you, and from there it is your choice.

~NL~

[~Natsumi Lam~]

you could throw away $500 gambling, or you could use it to send bibles to Asia or Africa (where there is often one bible per church)...i don't think the choice is very hard there. money is a gift from God, there are many people who don't even make $200 a year. don't waste your money gambling it away. It doesn't matter what personal feelings about it are - things are either right or wrong, whether we agree with that or not.

What stops you from doing both?

And if you are going to make such a statement... should you be overseas preaching right now... and shouldnt you not be on your comp and out saving people.

God gave us wisdom and fun in life... even with money.
<Personal conviction>

It doesn't matter what personal feelings about it are - things are either right or wrong, whether we agree with that or not.

Ok then, fare play then.... where does God say it is wrong?

And why would God give us personal conviction if he layed every choice out for us? Wisdom is Gods blessing for these kinda choices.. that and the HS.

~NL~

[truthgone12]

You know I don't want to gamble but I also don't want to go to a church where they take your money that they say is for poor people then the pastor uses it to buy a new car.

[~Natsumi Lam~]

and just because you do not feel convicted doesn't make it right. I mean you got people who do drugs and do other bad things and do they feel convicted? not really

but how does it fall with the other points.....


1. God says no against drugs... because it is against the government and lacking wisdom and has demonic forces behind it.

make sure you got all the points not only conviction. Because when we get past that point of pushing the HS down, the truth of God stands no matter what.

~NL~

[~Natsumi Lam~]

You know I don't want to gamble but I also don't want to go to a church where they take your money that they say is for poor people then the pastor uses it to buy a new car.

haha yea i totally agree!!! Been to a church like taht before hahah

~NL~

[Slater]

well, giving money to your church isn't just supposed to go to the poor. By paying in the offering, you're also paying the pastor and the church, which is a Biblical concept. You're supposed to give an offering; this is how members support the church body.

[~Natsumi Lam~]

[quote="frwl"]well, giving money to your church isn't just supposed to go to the poor. By paying in the offering, you're also paying the pastor and the church, which is a Biblical concept. You're supposed to give an offering]

That is what tithe is supposed to be used for. Your offering is for both.
tithe and offering are two different things.

~NL~

[Slater]

I know, but most churches nowadays lump them into one.

[Steeltemplar]

So.... when you guys say "The Church", which "The Church" do you mean? There's a lot of different denominations.

[Mr. SmartyPants]

but how does it fall with the other points.....


1. God says no against drugs... because it is against the government and lacking wisdom and has demonic forces behind it.

make sure you got all the points not only conviction. Because when we get past that point of pushing the HS down, the truth of God stands no matter what.

~NL~

What I mean is that every person does (or has done) a sin in their life which at the moment of doing that sin, does not feel any personal or religious conviction. Such as your average non-christian joe who looks at porn, or people having premarital sex... they don't feel that "Why did I do that?" (I mean many do, but likewise many dont)

[truthgone12]

I don't think every non-christian looks at porn.

[Mr. SmartyPants]

I don't think every non-christian looks at porn.

its a pretty much standard fact that pretty much EVERY single male (except Jesus) HAS, HAD, or WILL lust at a women.... its a nondisbutable fact. EVERYONE is fallable

Now that doesn't JUSTIFY the action! It is still very wrong to do so

[truthgone12]

Yes but you said that all non-christians look at porn and we all know that's not true.

[Mr. SmartyPants]

Yes but you said that all non-christians look at porn and we all know that's not true.

What I mean is that every person does (or has done) a sin in their life which at the moment of doing that sin, does not feel any personal or religious conviction. Such as your average non-christian joe who looks at porn, or people having premarital sex... they don't feel that "Why did I do that?" (I mean many do, but likewise many dont)

where did I say that all non-christians look at porn?

now a christian on the other hand, WILL feel that guilt after viewing pornographic material... they feel that conviction

anyway. back on topic

I do not wish to gamble ^^;; I'm afraid I'll get addicted to it

[Mr. Rogers]

And if you are going to make such a statement... should you be overseas preaching right now... and shouldnt you not be on your comp and out saving people.
~NL~

saving up for japan right now...and until then i will work with my family and friends

[SonicRose]

I have mixed feelings about gambling.

On the One hand, Los Vegas has one of the highest Suicide rates in the country, you can see where Gambling, Drinking, Smoking, Drugs, and a host of other sins tend to culminate around one another. I've also felt personally ignored by my boyfriend when he was playing online Poker frequently, and worry that he'd become addicted, and wonder how that'll affect us in the future.

On the other hand, Bingo and other chance games can be kinda fun. It's most fun to me when there's actually no prize at the end, when it's just for fun. Like a board game such as Chutes and Ladders or CandyLand. Most gambling doesn't require a great deal of mental alertness. Kind of why parents play things like CandyLand and Chutes and Ladders - Anyone can win.

On AOL, Mom and I used to play "Slingo", a combination Slot Machine and Bingo Board. It was very fun, there was nothing really at stake. I just kinda liked the jingle of coins when you won :3

If you want some scriptural backing, as it's not speficically mentioned as a sin...

1 Corinthians 6:12 All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.
10:23 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not.

That which is not explicitly sin, is an area of gray which is a matter of personal choice. This includes Smoking, Gambling, Drinking, Watching TV etc.
But if you are of Christ, then it should be something that does not rule you (I will not be brought under the power of any).
Also, though it's not bad to do, it doesn't necciccarily profit you anything - there is no gain or Glory for God in it. (but all things edify not)

And also...

Romans 11:11 For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.

Let's have an example of this as a Gambler andex-gambler. A Brother is Saved, and he was addicted horribly to Gambling. Though he's saved, he still feels like he could fall into that trap again. His Gambling Brother should not intice him to gamble, or gamble around him as it puts a stumbling block in his way. Like offering a drink to an ex Alcoholic. Some brothers or sisters in Christ might not have a problem with that, but for the brother that does, out of respect, you shouldn't do what was his sin in front of him.

My Father used to Idolize the Beatles, since he's been Saved, he's grown to despise that. The Beatles were his gurus - and it's hard to forgive that when John Lennon said that the Beatles were larger than Jesus. I still like some Beatles Music, though for his sake, I don't listen to it at home.

I know some Christians who don't celebrate Christmas because of the Paganism in it; that's fine. It's a matter of Conscience. But if you do any of these things that is questionable, and another christian does not - don't look down your nose at the other thinking "Oh I'm better than him/her because I do/Don't do that thing."

Obviously, if you see a Brother or Sister that is doing something Obviously Wrong or Sinful - Correct them on it; you do have a biblical obligation to do so. Following that; it is within the right of the Church to excommunicate a brother who refuses correction which is biblical - such as a Brother with an alcohol problem who repeatedly screws up; those people give a bad name to Christians and Christianity, and are (whether saved or unsaved) Spiritually Blinded.

What you do with your money is up to you. I've heard enough sermons on being stewards of God's Money and using it wisely - So, my Dad gave me a suggestion, that what money I use toward Video games etc. that I try to match that with whatever I offer at Church.

[shooraijin]

What you do with your money is up to you. I've heard enough sermons on being stewards of God's Money and using it wisely - So, my Dad gave me a suggestion, that what money I use toward Video games etc. that I try to match that with whatever I offer at Church.

That's an intriguing suggestion.

[Slater]

I've also felt personally ignored by my boyfriend when he was playing online Poker frequently, and worry that he'd become addicted, and wonder how that'll affect us in the future.

I'm not gonna become addicted to playing for play money (or freerolls for that matter )

BTW, that is the verse that I had running through my head and now I'm gonna remember the reference. It is acceptable, but it might not be good for j00. Kinda like wine. Bible never condemns drinking alcohol (portion of the scripture actually tells us when we should have someone drink... either in psalms or proverbs), but if it looks like it's gonna cause problems, you gotta stay away from it. So it's not really personal choice... It's dependat on personal reflection... Is this thing that I'm doing pushing me farhter away from God or not?

[truthgone12]

You know backwards the pokemon lyrics are a satanic message. LoL yea I know off topic. But yeah John Lennon did say the beatles where bigger then Jesus but people say stupid things so that is forgivable. One of my favorite bands lead singer was controversial I don't care. I only care about the Music.

[agasfas]

sometimes during family get togethers like thanksgiving or something my uncles play nickel, dime and quarter poker. Fairly cheap and fun. It's more of a social thing really. PLus it's kind of fun and it puts no one at risk of really lossing anything.

Though I think gambeling can also be a bad thing if taken to extreme. For people who risk it all, or put themselves or others at risk in expense to have a thrill or become a millionare (get rich quick sceme). But I see nothing wrong with playing for pocket money or fun... or saving up a few hundred and going to vegas for a few days and spend only a certain amount.

I guess it really depends on a few things: Why one is gambling, how much they are betting, and whether or not it's going to affect anyone because of it (the risk involved)