The decision not to have kids(a rant).

[Yamamaya]

Why hello there guys. I've noticed in our society there is quite a stigma towards couples or people who decide not to have children. I find this quite appalling so in this rant I plan to take on some of the statements thrown out there by the crowd who insist that everyone must have children.
1. An assumption that you must be selfish if you decide not to have kids.
This one makes no sense to me at all. Let's say I have the tools and materials to make a chair. I don't need a chair, but I can make one if I want. Who in the world would call me selfish if I decided not to make the chair? There's nothing selfish about deciding not to bring a nonexistant entity into existence.

2. What about your parents? They need grandchildren!
Sorry but it's your decision. You're the ones who have to deal with the kids 24/7. You can't decide to have kids just because your parents want to be grandparents.

3. But people have to multiply!
Yeah there are plenty of people out there. There are enough people having kids as it is. The world's getting overpopulated bro.

4. But kids bring joy!
Yes, but they are also little terrors. And not all people are suited for having kids. I don't have the patience for them. I love my nephews but they drive me insane.

Edit: I don't think all children are terrible. They do bring joy to people, and they have their good points just like all stages of life. Not all people are suited for having them or dealing with them 24/7 though.

[Sapphire225]

I don't plan to have children, but my parents want me to if I ever do get married. I have a younger sister and brother, let them continue the generation, but as for me, I think I can do without little kids running around.

Besides, some people are better without children than with, and there is always the choice to adopt.

Besides, since I'm a female, 9 months of my life will be spent overindulging in food and sitting in pain for the labor aspect. Not to say that children are not a good thing, as they can be quite a blessing, but I think it isn't for me.

[Ante Bellum]

I approve.

I don't like kids. Never have. It's rare that I meet a kid I can deal with. My mom would keep telling me that she wanted grandchildren (and for me to marry). She never seemed to get that I would never do either. And when people hear that I will never have kids or even date, they ask why. Does there need to be a reason? I'm not obligated to do either.

[Atria35]

I've come across people who have a high liklihood of never having children due to medical reasons- but people still bug them about trying. Not only would that carry the risk of carrying on a severe disease (which they don't want to do), it would be years of attempting because of the issue that they have, and

-they would rather adopt children if they decided to have any.

The last one always seems to get people's panties in a twist. For some reason, a decent amount of people find it hard to imagine wanting to adopt if there's a chance they could have biological children.

It also seems rather sad. Why shouldn't people adopt children, even if they can have their own? Those children are already born and need good homes and loving families!

[Ante Bellum]

On the subject of adoption, I think more should try to adopt teens. It would be harder than raising a baby but, when most are trying for young kids, the older get left behind.

Also, wanting people to still have kids when there is a high potential for inherited disease/that the couple can't even have kids? There's something very, very wrong with that.

[acmcmxxvi]

You seem like someone after my own heart. I don't want any children. Christians sometimes mention "Be fruitful and multiply" - never mentioning Paul's suggestion (I think in Romans) that an unmarried man can serve the Lord with less hindrance. This obviously by extension is valid re. children.

[TopazRaven]

I personally never want to have to deal with child birth, but I'm very open to the idea of adopting or even fostering (perhaps both) children in need of homes. Maybe some day when I actually have my own house and make enough money to take care of things. I may never get married due to my shy and passive nature so hopefully single adoption will be aloud where I live once I get around to that...though I know a lot of people might object to that sort of thing I think it's kind of mean to say a stable person who could offer a safe and loving home to child can't adopt any children just because they are not married.

[TheMewster]

...though I know a lot of people might object to that sort of thing I think it's kind of mean to say a stable person who could offer a safe and loving home to child can't adopt any children just because they are not married.

That is so true. Then again, they probably think that if they allowed it, the child wouldn't have a father or mother figure, but divorced families almost always result in the SAME THING. So singles should be able to adopt.
I'm a selfish wimp and do NOT want to go through childbirth. God said for us to multiply but I think we have multiplied enough and having more will result in even worse overpopulation and even more children staying parentless instead of having a good, loving home. So when I get old enough, if my state allows it, I think I'm going to be adopting or fostering.

[Syreth]

I've come across people who have a high liklihood of never having children due to medical reasons- but people still bug them about trying. Not only would that carry the risk of carrying on a severe disease (which they don't want to do), it would be years of attempting because of the issue that they have, and

-they would rather adopt children if they decided to have any.

The last one always seems to get people's panties in a twist. For some reason, a decent amount of people find it hard to imagine wanting to adopt if there's a chance they could have biological children.

It also seems rather sad. Why shouldn't people adopt children, even if they can have their own? Those children are already born and need good homes and loving families!

Yes. If there are medical reasons not to have children, then it makes the decision even more serious. Aside from that, it's a highly personal decision.

[TWWK]

As a parent, I think I should throw this out there...some of you who say you don't want to ever have kids are very young. Things change when you get older. What you feel today could be drastically different 10 years from now...or 5 years from now...or even next year.

It's important to remember that God has a plan for us. What we feel, deep in our hearts, isn't necessarily what God wants from us. We should be open. And in fact it's possible that God may use children to help weed out those non-parentlike qualities in us (impatience, inability to establish loving relationships, lack of grace, etc.). I know that without my children, my temper and impatience would have continued to worsen, instead of growing better.

[Edward]

As a parent, I think I should throw this out there...some of you who say you don't want to ever have kids are very young. Things change when you get older. What you feel today could be drastically different 10 years from now...or 5 years from now...or even next year.

This is my official stance. Right now, I definitly don't want to have kids, or even adopt, though my opinions could change in the future. But I still agree with the OP.

[Okami]

You seem like someone after my own heart. I don't want any children. Christians sometimes mention "Be fruitful and multiply" - never mentioning Paul's suggestion (I think in Romans) that an unmarried man can serve the Lord with less hindrance. This obviously by extension is valid re. children.

1 Corinthians 7:32-35, actually. [quote]But I want you to be free from concern. One who is unmarried is concerned about the things of the Lord, how he may please the Lord]

This topic is one of the many that make me really want to write a paper on the equality of marriage and celibacy.

[Sapphire225]

As a parent, I think I should throw this out there...some of you who say you don't want to ever have kids are very young. Things change when you get older. What you feel today could be drastically different 10 years from now...or 5 years from now...or even next year.

It's important to remember that God has a plan for us. What we feel, deep in our hearts, isn't necessarily what God wants from us. We should be open. And in fact it's possible that God may use children to help weed out those non-parentlike qualities in us (impatience, inability to establish loving relationships, lack of grace, etc.). I know that without my children, my temper and impatience would have continued to worsen, instead of growing better.

That is a good point, opinions do change as you grow older, although my current stance is to not have them. Still, it is a pressing issue that some people do jump down the throats of others who are even old enough and married and still don't want children of their own. The thing is that the responsibilities fall upon the couple not the ones that try to persuade them.

[Yamamaya]

As a parent, I think I should throw this out there...some of you who say you don't want to ever have kids are very young. Things change when you get older. What you feel today could be drastically different 10 years from now...or 5 years from now...or even next year.

Fair enough. But the more I think about having a kid, the more the idea frightens me. Now, I have a little person running around causing chaos and I am responsible for that person. Not to mention the fact that I feel like my life would get consumed by all the children.

Also, I'm not a big fan of having the normal life.

It's important to remember that God has a plan for us. What we feel, deep in our hearts, isn't necessarily what God wants from us. We should be open. And in fact it's possible that God may use children to help weed out those non-parentlike qualities in us (impatience, inability to establish loving relationships, lack of grace, etc.). I know that without my children, my temper and impatience would have continued to worsen, instead of growing better.

I have a problem with this. Essentially this is to me is saying, "Hey bro, I heard you were impatient. So I'm giving you something that will make you even more impatient. Have fun!" Yes, it might help you get over the problem. However it can also have the opposite effect, considering that you're giving something that requires a ton of patience to someone with limited patience.

On a separate note, I hate it that people with kids seem to want everyone else to have kids. Like how they will "harass" married couples who don't have children with constant questions. Or how when married couples will complain about something, another married couple will say something like, "You have no room to complain. Wait till you have kids!" Maybe misery loves company in some cases.

[Dante]

I just don't feel a drive, neither to date, nor get married, nor have kids. Which has led to some odd notions of confusion by my parents in particular - they've asked me if I'm gay, they've noted the whole "you don't know what you're missing", or wondered why I don't want to mimic what they have (honestly if there is something more disturbing then me being married at the moment, it's me imagining myself as my parents in marriage - please, for the love of all that's holy, don't give your kids the visual image of the two of you as lovers instead of just Mom and Dad XD) all kinds of silly things. In return, I've noted that I'm perfectly happy with the life I have, that friends can provide me with all the companionship I need and that honestly life without kids will be vastly cheaper for me.

Now I won't deny that all of this may be a result of psychological damage, but if I don't feel it, why should I do it? And there is a good solid chance (especially if I don't have the desire to change it) that those psychological changes are permanent. If society get's it's knickers in a knot over it, that's their problem - they can spasm all they want.

[ADXC]

I personally don't want kids now, but who knows. God can change my heart to where I'll want kids.

I think most of us are just stubborn sometimes (Including me.) because secretly I think a lot of us just do not want to grow up. However, life changes all too quickly (You can ask me through PMs if you are having trouble understanding this.) and we really do not know what our future holds. So the best thing we can do is put our lives in God's hand and glorify him everyday whether that means to be single or to get married.

[Tsukuyomi]

1. An assumption that you must be selfish if you decide not to have kids.

I don't believe this to be true. It may look like that to others, but they don't know your exact reasonings now do they?

I have a friend who has made a huge decision when it comes to this. He was thinking about the future and considering all that was a huge possibility. The risk are way too high, so he decided to not have kids (by more extreme means) ^^

I thought it was very responsible of him ^^ His reason went beyond "I don't want kids." he actually loves kids, but seeing what he had to go through and what his parents had to, he doesn't want to put his kids through that and his wife ^^

Everyone has their personal choice and their personal reasoning ^__^

[Atria35]

You know, I know that I'd love to settle down, and eventually have kids. But I could never imagine pressing my reasons for wanting to have a family onto another. I fully support people who don't want children. I had to go through a very long soul-search on whether I could ever be up to having a kid.

And actually, I face the opposite problem- My family has no idea why on earth I would ever want to reproduce or adopt, and have admantly questioned me when I stated my opinion.

Go figure!

[Jingo Jaden]

There used to be a time where I feared nothing more than to have children. Figured it to be a pressure thing, wanting to stand out as a more individualist by focusing on a career path and whatnot. So, fast forward a few years and I am more open to the idea. I've learned a lot, things are going relatively well and by most accounts I got a bright future. I am also realistic when it comes to this topic. At present I feel too young, and without a good house I doubt I would even attempt to go into such a commitment.

Regardless, I've learned that few things are as important as family in life. I cannot express with words how happy I am with my family, despite there being so many things I wish to change. Yet, the desire to advance the family tree has for the first time peeked my interest. I think it might be a gradual thing, and that I one day may become a father. I love kids, despite being terrible with them.

As far as overpopulation goes, I'd say it is hardly the biggest problem in Europe/North America. So if you are around 25 years, got a nice house, a good wife and good prospects. Then sure, said person should not feel any impediments for wanting to have kids.

[Yamamaya]

You know, I know that I'd love to settle down, and eventually have kids. But I could never imagine pressing my reasons for wanting to have a family onto another. I fully support people who don't want children. I had to go through a very long soul-search on whether I could ever be up to having a kid.

This is my thoughts on the matter. A few times I've thought, "It might not be so bad to have a kid." But then I remember how it's like being around my nephews for a day and I change my mind. . Don't get me wrong, it's not that I dislike children. It's one thing to like children, it's another to take care of one 24/7.
I probably wouldn't want to marry a girl who was going to be pressuring me to give her babies all the time. If both partners don't want to have kids, there shouldn't be any pressure or trickery.

And actually, I face the opposite problem- My family has no idea why on earth I would ever want to reproduce or adopt, and have admantly questioned me when I stated my opinion.

Go figure!

That's rather odd. But I suppose all families are different .

My parents just say I'll want some when I get older which I guess is plausible.

My brother in law who has two kids agrees with my logic when I say, "The nice thing about being an uncle is you get to see your nephews for a while, then they go home to their parents"

[Agloval]

(Off topic: I like how the rant has become a genre of internet writing all of its own.)

Generally I agree with you. I have however noticed that while a lot of people I know who are my age can't imagine themselves ever having children, most people ten years older than me (I'm in my early twenties) either (a) have had children or (b) can at least contemplate it. Evidently something happens in those ten years which changes a lot of minds.

The only incentive I feel to have children is a deeply selfish one: I've seen my parents go through the last years of some of their parents, I'm having to come to terms with the thought of my parents' future deaths, and I'm very frightened by the thought of dying alone. I can regard all sorts of future calamities with equanimity, but the thought of extreme old age with no one to look after me terrifies me -- which is odd, because of all things that can happen in this life, it's the furthest away!

I suppose I have been blessed by children, very indirectly -- several people in my prayer group are parents, and observing their parenting has taught me things about parenthood which I couldn't have learned from my relationship with my parents. Which has in turn helped me to appreciate my parents more, and taught me more about the parent-aspect of God-the-Father's relationship with us.

(One of the things I'm very thankfull for about my parents is that they've never, ever even broached the idea that I might one day generate grandchildren for them.)

[Darth_Kirby]

To be honest I think it all comes down to the reasons why you don't want to have children. I've heard some women tell me straight out that they don't want children cause it will mess up their figure, that's just wrong. But if a person doesn't want children because they feel it will keep them from more important things (like serving God, etc) or that they just don't feel like they need/want to get married then I don't think that's wrong at all.

Yes. If there are medical reasons not to have children, then it makes the decision even more serious. Aside from that, it's a highly personal decision.

There is also, as mentioned above, matters of health to consider. If one avoids having kids because of this, there is nothing wrong with it in my mind. Though Syreth is right. This is an extremely personal decision. Don't judge, let God do that. We don't know the hearts of other people unless they tell us their feelings on the matter.

[shooraijin]

I used to be very much set on not having kids.

And, well, it moderated somewhat. I wouldn't mind not having kids, but I think I'd probably want to. I agree with TWWK that I think a lot of people panic when younger at the responsibility -- which is entirely rational, btw; why would you want to be saddled with that when you're not fully situated in your own life? As people get their situation stabilized or possibly even a factor of their "biological clock," which ticks even for men, I think many people's bias against having children moderates. It certainly did for me.

[Yuki-Anne]

I waver between the two: The thought of children and their mess and their annoyingness and their constant "Mommy mommy mommy mommy" and their crying and all that, it really makes me glad I'm not a mother.

But to be honest, I really, really want to be a mother. Like, I think part of the reason I say, "Eew, I don't want to have kids, how annoying" is to make it easier to deal with the fact that I want it so badly and it's nowhere on the horizon. I've got time, I'm only 23, but at the same time... At the same time...

And I live in Japan, where single Christian girls outnumber single Christian guys by 2 or 3 to 1. The numbers don't look good for me, people. *sigh*

/depressing post.

I'm going for now, this thread is depressing me too much. Not because of you guys. I wish I felt the same way you do. It'd make this so much easier. I say, if you don't want kids or marriage, more power to you. You're one of the lucky ones.

[ich1990]

Given the hazards of overpopulation as well as the huge number of kids that grow up homeless because no one is willing to adopt, I think any semi-stable couple has a moral obligation to not create more kids. Nobody likes to think that such a personal choice might be made for them by circumstances beyond their control, (think of how much flak China caught for their one-child policy) but the fact remains that we live in a global world and even our personal decisions affect everyone else.

I am totally open to adopting though, and might even pursue that as a single Dad if I could ever become financially independent enough to quit work.

[Yamamaya]

Given the hazards of overpopulation as well as the huge amount of kids that grow up homeless because no one is willing to adopt, I think any semi-stable couple has a moral obligation to not create more kids. Nobody likes to think that such a personal choice might be made for them by circumstances beyond their control, (think of how much flak China caught for their one-child policy) but the fact remains that we live in a global world and even our personal decisions affect everyone else.

I am totally open to adopting though, and might even pursue that as a single Dad, if I could ever become financially independent enough to quit work.

You definitely have a good point here. If only the adoption process wasn't so long and complicated.

You can do a great service to your society by helping kids out who grow up in unfortunate circumstances.

And I live in Japan, where single Christian girls outnumber single Christian guys by 2 or 3 to 1. The numbers don't look good for me, people. *sigh*

/depressing post.

I'm going for now, this thread is depressing me too much. Not because of you guys. I wish I felt the same way you do. It'd make this so much easier. I say, if you don't want kids or marriage, more power to you. You're one of the lucky ones.

Not to mention that most of those same single Christian guys(at least the ones that are not native Japanese) want Japanese women as I've stated before.

I'm sorry that it depressed you. That wasn't my intention. I do want to get married, but I'm not too keen on the idea of having kids.

[Yuki-Anne]

Okay, the overpopulation thing only applies to some countries. Here in Japan we have the opposite situation: Japan is in crisis because there aren't enough younger people growing up to carry on for the older generation.

EDIT: Haha, I said I'd leave but...

[TheMewster]

I waver between the two: The thought of children and their mess and their annoyingness and their constant "Mommy mommy mommy mommy" and their crying and all that, it really makes me glad I'm not a mother.

But to be honest, I really, really want to be a mother. Like, I think part of the reason I say, "Eew, I don't want to have kids, how annoying" is to make it easier to deal with the fact that I want it so badly and it's nowhere on the horizon. I've got time, I'm only 23, but at the same time... At the same time...

And I live in Japan, where single Christian girls outnumber single Christian guys by 2 or 3 to 1. The numbers don't look good for me, people. *sigh*

/depressing post.

I'm going for now, this thread is depressing me too much. Not because of you guys. I wish I felt the same way you do. It'd make this so much easier. I say, if you don't want kids or marriage, more power to you. You're one of the lucky ones.

*hugs Yuki* Hugs will make you feel less depressed!

[goldenspines]

Many people in this thread seem to think that all children are ticking time bombs, just waiting to destroy your life. XD; This is not true. I've seen some wonderfully behaved kids. It often depends on their personality and how their parents disciplined them.

Personally, because I'm neither close to being married or at any logical point in my life to care for a young life other than my own, I don't want children. I agree with most of you in the case of, yes, it should be your choice whether you want to have/adopt kids or not. It's up for you to decide depending on your place in life, maturity, personality, etc..
But "children are evil and little terrors" is not a good excuse.


Side note to the OP: I'm going to be quite honest here; your chair analogy was rather lame and insulting. Comparing a human life to a chair is quite unfeeling. While I understand where you are coming from, it doesn't help the validity of your case to treat having kids like making furniture.

[Rusty Claymore]

Ok, so it's not very Christ-like of me, but I do occasionally find myself looking down on those who don't want children. (Not those who can't or don't believe they can have them.) Mostly because it royally ticks me off that someone finds themselves inconvieniced by a fearfully and wonderfully made little critter. However, I definitely appreciate my rights to my opinions, so I won't force them on others. (btw, that's just my personal take on it, and I'm not implying this on anybody here. XD)

I think Shooraijin makes a good point.