when a church service can be boring

[fermy6]

I'm sure we all have a type of service that can be boring to us(excuse the grammer)...for me, if I'm in a church that has to sing the old type of hymn songs and everyone is organised in when they stand to sing it makes it kinda hard for me to absorb the message afterwards...I prefer it when the worship songs are more up beat and everyone is free to shout to the Lord when filled with the holy spirit, it makes the service all the more AWSOME...so what do u guys prefer to experience in a church service and what kind of service style dulls your senses making it hard for you to concentrate on the message

[Rusty Claymore]

Haha, I'm just about oposite. I'm not very fond of modern contemp christian, and am uncomfortable with chaotic services. But I am rather psychotic, and have always considered it a "game" to be able to pay attention no matter what. 0.o

[Ally-Ann]

The preacher has to be outgoing. I don't know how describe it, but I went to a church once and the preacher had this monotone voice the whole two hours of his sermon. I almost fell asleep. A thirteen-year-old girl shouldn't be falling asleep in church! Then again, maybe that just proves that I am a teenager.

[Atria35]

Most church services to me. I have a "processing" issue with my hearing. I'll hear stuff and know the words that were said but not understand what they mean for a few seconds. It's not all the time, but when it does happen (which is often enough), then I'm busy trying to know what was said two sentences ago and missed what came after.

And it's made worse when they're using the KJV bible, since I have issues comprehending that in the first place.

And on top of that I honestly don't have the patience to sit in church for more than an hour. Probably because I didn't grow up going to church, so it's uncomfortable to me to listen to long sermons.

[TheMelodyMaker]

This passage comes to mind as I read this thread...

[quote="2 Timothy 4:1-5 (NAS)"]I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by His appearing and His kingdom: preach the word]

I like a church in which the full Word of God is preached -- the bad with the good. I prefer that over one which tries to use unbiblical worldly methods of trying to draw in new members. Even if it seems "boring" at times, straight solid preaching of the Word is the only method that God commands use of in the pulpit through which He saves souls.

(Hope I haven't gotten too much off topic.)

[Furen]

For me, I don't know why but I find that if I'm not sitting during the messages I absorb it more, so it's really difficult for me to absorb anything because the adults in my church don't want me to stand, lay down, pace any of those because they don't find it respectful to do so, that's why I find that listening to the messages over the sound system broadcasted to other rooms are great becuase most people are not there and I can stand, lay down, pace, etc.

[Shao Feng-Li]

This passage comes to mind as I read this thread...



I like a church in which the full Word of God is preached -- the bad with the good. I prefer that over one which tries to use unbiblical worldly methods of trying to draw in new members. Even if it seems "boring" at times, straight solid preaching of the Word is the only method that God commands use of in the pulpit through which He saves souls.

(Hope I haven't gotten too much off topic.)

This.

While, yes, sometimes service can get a little boring, it's our problem. Church isn't here to entertain. We just have to work at being sober minded for 2 hours out of 168.

Fermy, you'd be bored out of your skull at my church. We sing Psalms with no instruments.

[Kunoichi]

I would say in the beginning I needed a church to be rocking it out for me to be able to pay attention. As I've gotten older, (and realize i don't take in things auditorily at all)..if i can write down the lessons and what not that the pastor is teaching then I'm good. I agree with what was posted earlier..if we feel the need to be entertained to attend church, that's something up with us, not the church.

[Alcuinus]

church... boring... hm.....

y'know, It's kinda funny when you think about it. I mean yo see all these churches especially in the US that have tried to solve this problem for years. They try to add better bands, cafeterias, host events, the whole gambit, but I think the problem is deeper than all that. I think it all started when the churches (albeit with good intentions) started to try to draw more people in to the church to hear the Gospel. The problem is they used the wrong message to do that. They tried to make things "relevant" to these unsaved people and "comfortable" for them and "non-condemning". All these things are good except when you implement them to appeal to the fleshly desires of unsaved people. the churches tried to appeal to the desires of the people to get them saved rather than point out the real issue and that is that the natural heart is deceitful and wicked (Jeremiah 17:9). So isn't it natural that people will leave when you tell them that after promising them the moon? So instead the church is forced to continue the charade. Except the Church is not the world and can't compete with it... and is thus boring.

What the churches need to realize is that they are not here to entertain or appeal to the desires of the masses. The message of the church is that you as a natural human are going to entertain yourself right into hell. The Gospel is a message of hope not entertainment. If we as Christian can only grasp that we would gain so much. There is a time to be sorrowful at church over our sins and there is a time to be joyful at church about Christ but without a proper understanding of the Word we can have neither. Thus there is a time to simply learn about God and His Word at church.

Simply put, the church is not here to entertain :S

[Lynna]

I find it really hard to focus, because most of the people in our church are older than me, so I just find it really hard to figure out what their trying to say in sermons

I mean, look at Jesus. When he preached, he often used illistrations and parables to explain things to the ordinairy people. I know that the church is not there to entertain, it's there for fellowship and teaching, but I find I'm really not learning anything...

I just think services should be more spirit-led and less peope-led

[ShiroiHikari]

The message of the church is that you as a natural human are going to entertain yourself right into hell. The Gospel is a message of hope not entertainment.

That doesn't sound very hopeful to me.

I think the bottom line is that some preachers are good speakers and some aren't. I admit that I find it hard to focus if they're prattling on for over an hour. Brevity is the soul of wit.

Also, some people like hymns and some like the more modern style of worship. There's nothing really wrong with either style, but if I don't like the worship style it puts me in a funky mood and makes it harder to focus. I know-- that's my own problem.

[Alcuinus]

That doesn't sound very hopeful to me.

I think the bottom line is that some preachers are good speakers and some aren't. I admit that I find it hard to focus if they're prattling on for over an hour. Brevity is the soul of wit.

Also, some people like hymns and some like the more modern style of worship. There's nothing really wrong with either style, but if I don't like the worship style it puts me in a funky mood and makes it harder to focus. I know-- that's my own problem.

LOLOLOL XD forgot the second clause!!! :X

EDIT:

The message of the church is that you as a natural human are fallen
and deserve eternal punishment, but God But God, being rich in mercy,
made us alive.

That's what I get for not proofreading 9_9

[Mr. SmartyPants]

I don't like church in general. =\

I need to start going regardless though.

[Hiryu]

I think I've discovered that I like working more than listening.

[Radical Dreamer]

You know, this is a really interesting thread. XD It's my personal opinion/taste/what-have-you that church shouldn't be boring. I mean, we kind of have the best news to talk about ever. Jesus saved us from our sins! That isn't boring at all, it's something to be celebrated! XD I personally go to a couple of culturally relevant churches that have pretty seamlessly mixed together not only honest worship with more of a rock style, but also truth with grace, and both of those with an atmosphere that isn't intimidating to a person who didn't grow up in church. One of you mentioned earlier something about churches that do this and somehow leave out important parts of God's Word, and while that may be true in some culturally relevant churches (I haven't been to all of them), it certainly isn't the case with the ones I've been attending for the past two years (well, one of them two years, the other only about a semester). I think it's great that some churches are making a friendlier environment for people who need Jesus, though. We can't always expect everyone to find Jesus and hear the good news about His sacrifice if we're only presenting Him in a way that requires them to show up dressed perfectly for the occasion. XD

[Nate]

I agree with Lynna. When Jesus preached, he used stories and parables. He fed people and healed them and attended to their physical needs. Jesus didn't just gather everyone up and say "I know you're hungry but I'm going to preach so just be quiet and listen and stop thinking about yourselves for once." He showed them real love by taking care of them, and making it interesting instead of just pulling out the Torah and saying "Here are some verses I will read."

I'm also the opposite of fermy. I like the older, slower, more melodic hymns. I don't care for CCM much at all really. It just doesn't connect with me. Now of course I'm not saying the church should cater just to my specific tastes. But they should mix it up. A few hymns, a few CCM, make everyone happy. But most churches just stick with one kind which is going to turn off at least a few people.

[Lynna]

Oh, and as for hymns, I like variety- modern ones, upbeat ones, and old-fashioned ones

[Alcuinus]

I mean, we kind of have the best news to talk about ever. Jesus saved us from our sins!

I completely agree! But the catch 22 is that that is an incredibly boring topic to anyone who is not a Christian. ]We can't always expect everyone to find Jesus and hear the good news about His sacrifice if we're only presenting Him in a way that requires them to show up dressed perfectly for the occasion. XD[/QUOTE]Thing is I don't expect a non-believer to come to church at all. The early church came together to hear the word of God (a boring topic for non-Christians). Evangelism happened only outside the church (especially during severe persecution).


Proposition:
Church is for studying Gods Word and worshiping Him.
Evangelism is for presenting the Gospel to the non-believers.

[SIZE="1"]P.S. Sorry for picking on your post Corrie :S it just kinda said what I saw all the other people saying only more concise [/SIZE]

[Dante]

church... boring... hm.....

y'know, It's kinda funny when you think about it. I mean yo see all these churches especially in the US that have tried to solve this problem for years. They try to add better bands, cafeterias, host events, the whole gambit, but I think the problem is deeper than all that. I think it all started when the churches (albeit with good intentions) started to try to draw more people in to the church to hear the Gospel. The problem is they used the wrong message to do that. They tried to make things "relevant" to these unsaved people and "comfortable" for them and "non-condemning". All these things are good except when you implement them to appeal to the fleshly desires of unsaved people. the churches tried to appeal to the desires of the people to get them saved rather than point out the real issue and that is that the natural heart is deceitful and wicked (Jeremiah 17:9). So isn't it natural that people will leave when you tell them that after promising them the moon? So instead the church is forced to continue the charade. Except the Church is not the world and can't compete with it... and is thus boring.

What the churches need to realize is that they are not here to entertain or appeal to the desires of the masses. The message of the church is that you as a natural human are going to entertain yourself right into hell. The Gospel is a message of hope not entertainment. If we as Christian can only grasp that we would gain so much. There is a time to be sorrowful at church over our sins and there is a time to be joyful at church about Christ but without a proper understanding of the Word we can have neither. Thus there is a time to simply learn about God and His Word at church.

Simply put, the church is not here to entertain :S

Yeah. That would go down to the ground in flames. We have a few of those around still, but I don't see them really gathering any momentum any time until the next dark ages - and if they had so much to gain in their lives from this I think the opposite would be happening.

I would say that modern Christianity suffers the most because it still hates to be "relevant" in people's lives. Much like ages past, they cling to the desire for "tradition" and require their congregation to be made of people that are all the same. If the goal of Christianity is to hold onto tradition so that it can be relevant in the lives of people from the 1300s, then they're going to completely lose people in the modern world. It would have done awesome hundreds of years ago, but philosophy, theology and ethics have undergone some major breakthroughs in the mean time. Like togas went out of style to be replaced with suits, suits have gone out of style to be replaced by shorts and a t-shirt. The ancient songs of Rome (Don't even begin to claim they were like Choral hymns by Martin Luther), went out of style to choirs, which changed to more "hip" hymns during the creation of the Protestant Church, which in turn made a jump in modern times to Christian Rock.

The fact is, is that if the Church doesn't make a continuous solid effort to be completely relevant to the members of it's congregation, they won't be able to apply it in their lives and they will leave, or never show up at all. If you're going off threatening to send them to Hell, they can always drag a Muslim over who can proceed to describe that YOU, the Christian are actually going to burn in Hell. And if you compare the two main figures of these worlds, most people would find both to be completely as off-the-wall insane as the other unless you've actually decided to join the faith (then, depending on whichever faith you join, people tend to say it's absolutely true and they wonder how anyone could doubt >_>).

If you can't build a church that's "relevant" to people's lives, that meets the spiritual and emotional needs of a human being living with the troubles of the modern world, by what claim do you suddenly declare you know the fate of our soul? You can't even make the souls in your own congregation happy to exist and you claim to have the God of the universe. The failure of the Christian church to understand the human soul has been such a gross failure, that it is considered one of the founding origins of psychotherapy. That is, therapy was "supposed" to come from your religious faith. Faith would provide the answers to help bring balance and heal the wounds "of the soul". After all, it was their entire life's devotion to study the soul. But because of their "traditions" and love of "condemning people" they managed to build such a bad model of the soul of humans beings, that psychologists made more progress in learning to heal and understand the soul of man then so-called followers of the God of the universe did in a couple of thousand years. To add to their failure, most pastors don't even take the time to study psychology, which would grant them a significant capability of at least understanding the souls of their congregation better. They may have one thing right about our eventual fates, but you certainly wouldn't know it from the rest of their portfolio.

Instead, they hold onto their tradition instead of choosing to be relevant. Church could find a vast array of means of celebrating the human spiritual gift (not just in music (and not just rock), but in all forms of arts or studies that lend themselves to the heart), a vast array of worship that would allow people to fully embrace their spiritual side, they could provide messages that scream "wait, that's me! Tell me more, tell me more!", with outcomes that left them realizing they were less alone and that others were there to support and heal them and realize their true potential as human beings. Pastors could learn to understand the hearts of their congregation and minister to individuals in a manner that heals instead of burns (Christ harmed none, yet healed many). Then, it would be a thrill to go to church, an opportunity to explore one's inner self and spiritual side through a wide array of avenues for people of all different strengths and weaknesses. Not a court of condemnation from God, but a refuge from the world that wasn't simply open on Sundays...

Or we could continue to pretend that our vision from the 1800s is what God "always wanted" for the church and that suits and hair-buns and dress shoes and organs and choir hymns have been part of the church since 0 A.D (and if it was "good enough for dem, it ought be good enough for us"). People will analyze their own hearts and the sensitive will realize that what is claimed by traditionalists and what they feel often don't match for themselves and simply leave as belief cannot hold under such gross hypocrisy of so-called truth having it's roots in lies. The Christian Church can die and those that call themselves Christian will simply do as I've done over the years and keep their Christianity as a private affair, something they explore on their own because they don't feel at home with others who hold a stringent dogma that doesn't fit with our humanity. We don't have a church anymore, but the sad part is that we would feel worse with then without it.

[Radical Dreamer]

[quote="Alcuinus (post: 1445814)"]I completely agree! But the catch 22 is that that is an incredibly boring topic to anyone who is not a Christian. ]

On your first point, over 120 people got saved across four or five separate campuses at my church last week. It absolutely does work, and it shows that people who don't know Jesus DO care about more than just the presentation. And that's only last week.

On your second point, that's what inviting people to church is for. People may not come of their own accord, but inviting unsaved friends to church is absolutely part of evangelism. You simply can't say that Jesus isn't going to use a specific message to soften someone's heart towards Him. The purpose of church is to preach the Gospel of Christ, both to people who haven't yet heard it, as well as people who have and need to be reminded of it daily so they can better live it out. And if we aren't doing that, what are we doing?

[Alcuinus]

Yeah. That would go down to the ground in flames...

[color="DimGray"]hm... first a question (perhaps of nothing more than curiosity... I don't feel like jumping into a flame today )

what do you base your ideas on? do you base your ideas on the Bible or on reason or on the words of a philosopher or on something else?[/color]
EDIT2:forget it... I don't want to debate... I am going home in 40mins and don't need the stress


EDIT:

The purpose of church is to preach the Gospel of Christ

That's where we disagree I'm afraid. That can be a part of it, but only a small part.

And if we aren't doing that, what are we doing?

everything. We talk, we draw, we sing, we proclaim the Gospel all for Christ, but we do not do all those things at church. We live them 7 days a week and on Sunday we praise God and hear the preaching of the Word.

[Nate]

I pick on Pascal a lot and harp on him for having bizarre and sometimes incomprehensible posts.

But not this time. I agree with Pascal's post completely, 100%. He said everything I believe and more. He stated it better than I ever could have.

what do you base your ideas on? do you base your ideas on the Bible or on reason or on the words of a philosopher or on something else?

It can be all three of those things. It's not a "pick one and only one" choice. Otherwise we'd still think wearing 50% cotton/50% polyester shirts and being clean-shaven was a sin and that you'd have to condemn your house if it had mold in it. You can base your beliefs on the Bible, AND reason, AND on philosophy. It isn't hard to do!

[Dante]

It can be all three of those things. It's not a "pick one and only one" choice. Otherwise we'd still think wearing 50% cotton/50% polyester shirts and being clean-shaven was a sin and that you'd have to condemn your house if it had mold in it. You can base your beliefs on the Bible, AND reason, AND on philosophy. It isn't hard to do!

That pretty much sums it up, although I ask council from my heart as well. It may not always be right, but at least doing so actively respects who I am.

_______________

I don't want to hate on anybody, nor do I desire a debate (believe as you desire) I've just found in my personal life that the traditionalist approach hasn't yielded any fruit for me, only thorns. (see number 4 of things I don't miss from my child-hood)

If it yields fruit for someone here, all the power to them, they just might be spiritually designed for that kind of world, it's a real pity they came to the Earth a few hundred years too late. But the rest of us have to live (and feel we were meant to live) in the modern world, so we need a church or at least a spiritual philosophy that is relevant to our spiritual life. And people have come to realize that "relevant" means different things for different people. Any church that met this criteria would be relevant for them as well as for me, but not telling them to live their life like mine, nor telling me to live my life like theirs, but instead to pursue our individual best for our human spirituality. What that will look like will differ as much as the variety of people that enter such a church.

[Shao Feng-Li]

I'm all for churches dealing with modern issues and what not. But I don't like what people have done with the worship service itself. I mean, I've been to the church where where they've got the clowns or the guys just come to see the preachers wife sing. It's just a bunch of emotional nonsense. There's no doctrine, no teaching. All the kids thought it was a big deal to memorize the verse John 3:16. They just have fun listening to bad covers of fluffy Christian music. Any idea of law was "Now just be nice to each other."

Churches can put on productions and have some fun, obviously, but leave the solemn service alone. This is God almighty that's being worshiped here. Have a little dignity.

And we must remember that Faith comes by hearing. It is only the Churches duty to preach the gospel and its whole truth. Preach that God loves his people and sends sinners to Hell. That he loved Noah and his family and yet destroyed every other soul. He loved Jacob and hated Esau. People must now that the consequences of sin are death and Hell. The bible tells us the Fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. If people hear true and whole preaching, it'll either grow in them and change them or they will reject it.

[Nate]

It's just a bunch of emotional nonsense. There's no doctrine, no teaching.

As much as I'm all for teaching, because I find intellectual stimulation interesting, I think you need the emotional stuff too. I actually think a major problem with some churches is they focus too much on one or the other. All teaching and doctrine with no emotion is just as bad as all emotion with no intelligent substance to it. You need a balance of both. Psalms is just as important as Romans.

leave the solemn service alone. This is God almighty that's being worshiped here. Have a little dignity.

God is our Father. I think God, like our earthly fathers, enjoys watching us have fun. He likes seeing us laugh and play. We're his children, and He loves us. I believe God likes it when we're having fun, especially if that fun comes from worshiping Him.

Now of course, as I said before, everyone has a different idea of fun. Some people love singing and listening to music, I have more fun listening to the sermon because it's much more interesting. And again, as you and I both said, we do need the teaching as much as the singing. Because God wants us to enjoy ourselves, but He also wants us to learn and grow. You won't learn and grow by just singing and listening to music.

[Shao Feng-Li]

I know. I'm just saying, I remember a church I went to and all it was was an emotional trip for everyone. I didn't mean to say that all emotions are nonsense.

I dunno. "Fun" in worship just kinda rubs me the wrong way. His worship isn't meant to be play time. The Bible calls it solemn.

[Nate]

But if we're not enjoying ourselves when we worship Him, what is the point? I'm not saying worship is to make us feel better. That's obviously completely wrong. What I'm saying is if someone is sitting there going "Man this is so boring I can't stand it" and their mind wanders because they're not enjoying the worship, what pleasure does it offer to God? Their heart is not in it. They're going through the motions. They're paying lip service.

I think God appreciates worship much more when the person is enjoying it and giving their whole heart to God. If a person does that by dancing, or swaying their arms, or playing a sweet guitar solo, then hey, more power to 'em! That's how they worship, that's how they give themselves to God, that's how they say "God here is all of me praising and worshiping you."

And some people give their whole heart to God with quiet, somber reflection. That's awesome too! But again, everyone is different, and worship in different ways. And some people do need "fun" to truly give their hearts to God. And I think God enjoys the people who dance and have fun while worshiping Him just as much as the people who stay still and dignified. As long as they're pouring out their hearts to Him, and praising Him, I think He's happy.

[Syreth]

Church should be engaging, whatever its purpose is. If you aren't engaged in worshiping God, then are you actually worshiping?

[ShiroiHikari]

But again, everyone is different, and worship in different ways.

Everyone is different. No two people are not on fire.





Awwww.

[mechana2015]

I know. I'm just saying, I remember a church I went to and all it was was an emotional trip for everyone. I didn't mean to say that all emotions are nonsense.

I dunno. "Fun" in worship just kinda rubs me the wrong way. His worship isn't meant to be play time. The Bible calls it solemn.

Psalms 33, 66, 81, 95, 98, and 100 are just some of the Psalms ( not to mention the rest of the bible) that mention worship being noisy or joyful, which would be the exact opposite of solemn.