I didn't know where else to put this so here goes...
Is there such a thing as a good or bad christian?
My friend(Who has also just turned christian quite recently) was called a bad christian, that the Lord God and Jesus don't love her as much as others.
I thought it was a mean thing to say to her because she's just recovering from severe deppression, but is it true?
I hope someone can clear this up for me.
Good Christian/Bad Christian?
13 posts •
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Kawaii_Angel - Posts: 191
- Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 11:29 am
- Location: United Kingdom(UK)
Wow. . . that's aweful!
Some Christians may be following Jesus more closely than your friend, but I'm pleased to tell you that Jesus doesn't play favorites. This "bad christian, good christians" thing was invented by people because of our totally flawed views of ourselves. We look at some christians and say "Oh, look at them! They're so wonderful. They give money to the poor, they visit people who are in a hospital." and becasue they don't have any obvious sins in their lives, we think "They don't do any BAD things. They just commit 'little' sins."
But when we look at other christian who have obvious sin battles (like drugs or alcohol) in their lives, we tend to shake our heads and think that they "Do so many bad things that Jesus can't possibly love them as much as he loves the good people."
Here's where the "good christian, bad christian" mentatily comes in. This idea has been invented by self-righteous christians (I fall into this pit more often than most, so don't think I'm judging anyone. That's not my job) because our little brains can't understand the nature of a perfect God.
Let me explain. God is holy which means to be totally void of any fault. He has never sinned. In the sight of a perfect God, every sin, even the "little ones" that "good christians" commit, is unbearable and is enough to condemn us to eternal punishment in Hell. It is only by Jesus's blood that we are forgiven. If your friend has asked Jesus's forgiveness for her sins, evey thing she has done has forgiven.
In the Romans it says that "neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come, nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord." In other worlds, nothing we can do is too big for Jesus's love.
Just tell you friend the above and remind her that "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. " (1 John 1:9). If your friends has done something to make people say these things, then all she has to do is ask Jesus to forgive her. And if she's already asked Jesus's forgiveness, she can be sure that Jesus loves her SOOOOO MUCH and just as much as any other Christian!!!!
I feel so sorry for you friend and I'll be praying for her. When people say things like this they are not only judging your friend, they are limiting God's power to forgive. It's so sad.
I hope this makes sense and helps. Sorry it's so long. I just
am so deeply saddened when Christians act like they know more about
Jesus's love and forgiveness than Jesus does.
Some Christians may be following Jesus more closely than your friend, but I'm pleased to tell you that Jesus doesn't play favorites. This "bad christian, good christians" thing was invented by people because of our totally flawed views of ourselves. We look at some christians and say "Oh, look at them! They're so wonderful. They give money to the poor, they visit people who are in a hospital." and becasue they don't have any obvious sins in their lives, we think "They don't do any BAD things. They just commit 'little' sins."
But when we look at other christian who have obvious sin battles (like drugs or alcohol) in their lives, we tend to shake our heads and think that they "Do so many bad things that Jesus can't possibly love them as much as he loves the good people."
Here's where the "good christian, bad christian" mentatily comes in. This idea has been invented by self-righteous christians (I fall into this pit more often than most, so don't think I'm judging anyone. That's not my job) because our little brains can't understand the nature of a perfect God.
Let me explain. God is holy which means to be totally void of any fault. He has never sinned. In the sight of a perfect God, every sin, even the "little ones" that "good christians" commit, is unbearable and is enough to condemn us to eternal punishment in Hell. It is only by Jesus's blood that we are forgiven. If your friend has asked Jesus's forgiveness for her sins, evey thing she has done has forgiven.
In the Romans it says that "neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come, nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord." In other worlds, nothing we can do is too big for Jesus's love.
Just tell you friend the above and remind her that "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. " (1 John 1:9). If your friends has done something to make people say these things, then all she has to do is ask Jesus to forgive her. And if she's already asked Jesus's forgiveness, she can be sure that Jesus loves her SOOOOO MUCH and just as much as any other Christian!!!!
I feel so sorry for you friend and I'll be praying for her. When people say things like this they are not only judging your friend, they are limiting God's power to forgive. It's so sad.
I hope this makes sense and helps. Sorry it's so long. I just
am so deeply saddened when Christians act like they know more about
Jesus's love and forgiveness than Jesus does.
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Mangafanatic - Posts: 4918
- Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 5:00 am
- Location: In La-La land.
Thank you so much for clearing that up!I told her what you mentioned and she's a lot happier now, so am I for that matter!
Thank you so much!^__^
Thank you so much!^__^
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Kawaii_Angel - Posts: 191
- Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 11:29 am
- Location: United Kingdom(UK)
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Mangafanatic - Posts: 4918
- Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 5:00 am
- Location: In La-La land.
Good response, Mangafanatic.
This thread reminds me of a certain scripture:
luke 18:10-14
10 "Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, 'God, I thank You that I am not like other men--extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I possess.' 13 And the tax collector, standing afar off, would not so much as raise his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me a sinner!' 14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."
This thread reminds me of a certain scripture:
luke 18:10-14
10 "Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, 'God, I thank You that I am not like other men--extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I possess.' 13 And the tax collector, standing afar off, would not so much as raise his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me a sinner!' 14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."
Idle hands are indeed the devil's playground. -_- 
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YesIExist - Posts: 245
- Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 4:00 am
- Location: Somewhere you aren't
That's a good point. And, we know "that man looks on the outwards appearance, but God looks on the heart"!!
Every year in Uganda, innumerable children simply. . . disappear. These children all stolen under the cover of darkness from their homes and impressed into the guerilla armies of the LRA [Lord's Resistance Army]. In the deserts of Uganda, they are forced to witness the mindless slaughter of other children until they themselves can do nothing but kill. Kill. These children, generally ranging from ages 5-12, are brainwashed into murdering in the name of the resistance and into stealing other children from their beds to suffer the same fate.
Because of this genocide of innocence, hundred and hundreds of children live every night sleeping in public places miles from their homes, because they know that if the do not-- they will disappear. They will become just another number in this genocide to which the international community has chosen to turn a blind eye. They will become, in affect, invisible-- Invisible Children.
But there are those who are trying to fight against this slaughter of Uganda's children. They fight to protect these "invisible children." Please, help them help a country full of children who know nothing by fear. Help save the innocence. For more information concerning how you can help and how you can get an incredible video about this horrific reality, visit the Invisible Children home page.
Because of this genocide of innocence, hundred and hundreds of children live every night sleeping in public places miles from their homes, because they know that if the do not-- they will disappear. They will become just another number in this genocide to which the international community has chosen to turn a blind eye. They will become, in affect, invisible-- Invisible Children.
But there are those who are trying to fight against this slaughter of Uganda's children. They fight to protect these "invisible children." Please, help them help a country full of children who know nothing by fear. Help save the innocence. For more information concerning how you can help and how you can get an incredible video about this horrific reality, visit the Invisible Children home page.
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Mangafanatic - Posts: 4918
- Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 5:00 am
- Location: In La-La land.
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Kawaii_Angel - Posts: 191
- Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 11:29 am
- Location: United Kingdom(UK)
I'm warning you beforehand that what I say may sound a bit blunt.
I have no patience whatsoever for Christians who rank themselves higher than other. Pride is something I deteste.
In my opinion the Christians who say who is good and who is bad are the bad Christians! Those who turn round and say that God loves one person more than another because of what they do, do NOT understand the Gospel.
It makes me wonder if those who say such lies are Christians or not, I find it hard to understand that someone who understands the gospel and understands what Christ did could turn around and speak lies from the pit of hell when they know Christ.... Makes no sense to me.
In truth ALL of us are bad, none of us live up to God's perfection. Man's righteousness are as filthy rags in his sight.
Then the good news. Through Jesus' sacrifice God has imparted his righteousness to us. He has given us white robes to wear. Christ's purity given to us...
Amazing thing isn't it? Only since sitting here typing this that it's begun to sink in just how amazing it is... God remembers our sins no more... He has wiped them out of existence.
I have no patience whatsoever for Christians who rank themselves higher than other. Pride is something I deteste.
In my opinion the Christians who say who is good and who is bad are the bad Christians! Those who turn round and say that God loves one person more than another because of what they do, do NOT understand the Gospel.
It makes me wonder if those who say such lies are Christians or not, I find it hard to understand that someone who understands the gospel and understands what Christ did could turn around and speak lies from the pit of hell when they know Christ.... Makes no sense to me.
In truth ALL of us are bad, none of us live up to God's perfection. Man's righteousness are as filthy rags in his sight.
Then the good news. Through Jesus' sacrifice God has imparted his righteousness to us. He has given us white robes to wear. Christ's purity given to us...
Amazing thing isn't it? Only since sitting here typing this that it's begun to sink in just how amazing it is... God remembers our sins no more... He has wiped them out of existence.
I am the Reaper of Souls... and it's harvest time.
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skynes - Posts: 742
- Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 8:39 am
- Location: N Ireland
Our ability to resist temptation has no effect on whether we are "good" or "bad" in God's eyes, nor does it have any effect on how much God loves us. Therefore no matter what sins you struggle with (yes that's right folks, EVEN things like drug addiction, homosexuality, sexual immorality, etc.) you are no "better" or "worse" than any other Christian in God's eyes.
I get fed up when Christians look down on certain sins and think they are somehow "worse" than the ones they themselves commit every day. It is easy to look down on someone who has commited a sin that you have not. People who think in this way have a bad grasp on the core truth of Christianity.
Skynes explained it pretty well.
I get fed up when Christians look down on certain sins and think they are somehow "worse" than the ones they themselves commit every day. It is easy to look down on someone who has commited a sin that you have not. People who think in this way have a bad grasp on the core truth of Christianity.
Skynes explained it pretty well.
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Straylight - Posts: 2346
- Joined: Mon May 26, 2003 12:00 pm
- Location: Manchester, UK
Mangafanatic, I enjoyed your explanation. Thanks. You have a very good grasp of God, and I love to read when others write in here and really know Whom they're talking about. ^_^
[size=84][color=seagreen]YOU SEE
You see into the deepest part of me ---
beyond the fog I hide behind.
You cast your light upon the shadows
that stretch like cobwebs in my mind.
You ease the pain when I am hurting,
and morbid visions from my past
pierce into the realm of Reason
as though I danced on blades of glass.
You grant me strength when I have fallen
and, once again, I've lost my way.
You take my hand in Yours and lead me
into the promise of a brand new day.
You bring order to all my chaos,
yet set my well-laid plans awry.
You place me on a firm foundation ---
then give me wings so I can fly.
You sand away my roughened edges
and polish all the dullest parts
until I stand before Your presence...
a newly-sculpted work of art.
You see into the heart within me,
right through my motives and selfish will.
And yet, in spite of all You see
You say You love me even still.
~by D.M.~
[/color][/size]
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true_noir_chloe - Posts: 3091
- Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 12:00 pm
- Location: Where Tex-Mex is the best! ^_____^
You're welcome.Every year in Uganda, innumerable children simply. . . disappear. These children all stolen under the cover of darkness from their homes and impressed into the guerilla armies of the LRA [Lord's Resistance Army]. In the deserts of Uganda, they are forced to witness the mindless slaughter of other children until they themselves can do nothing but kill. Kill. These children, generally ranging from ages 5-12, are brainwashed into murdering in the name of the resistance and into stealing other children from their beds to suffer the same fate.
Because of this genocide of innocence, hundred and hundreds of children live every night sleeping in public places miles from their homes, because they know that if the do not-- they will disappear. They will become just another number in this genocide to which the international community has chosen to turn a blind eye. They will become, in affect, invisible-- Invisible Children.
But there are those who are trying to fight against this slaughter of Uganda's children. They fight to protect these "invisible children." Please, help them help a country full of children who know nothing by fear. Help save the innocence. For more information concerning how you can help and how you can get an incredible video about this horrific reality, visit the Invisible Children home page.
Because of this genocide of innocence, hundred and hundreds of children live every night sleeping in public places miles from their homes, because they know that if the do not-- they will disappear. They will become just another number in this genocide to which the international community has chosen to turn a blind eye. They will become, in affect, invisible-- Invisible Children.
But there are those who are trying to fight against this slaughter of Uganda's children. They fight to protect these "invisible children." Please, help them help a country full of children who know nothing by fear. Help save the innocence. For more information concerning how you can help and how you can get an incredible video about this horrific reality, visit the Invisible Children home page.
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Mangafanatic - Posts: 4918
- Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 5:00 am
- Location: In La-La land.
Yes, according to my pastor, a supposed 'little white lie' is no worse than a mass killiing spree. All sins are equal in God's sight. Therefore, the people we think most unlikely to accept our Saviour can, and they can be forgiven just as easily as any others. I'm aware that I've looked down on people like Saddam Hussein, and Osama Bin Laden, since the sins they've commited seem so much worse than what normal people do. That's not true. Nothing they've done is any worse than what we've done in God's eyes.
I'm pretty sure about all of this. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
I'm pretty sure about all of this. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
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[color="Red"]Distance is to Love as Wind is to Fire...it extinguishes the small, and ignites the great. - Unknown[/color]
[color="RoyalBlue"]“Falling in love with someone isn't always going to be easy... Anger... tears... laughter.. It's when you want to be together despite it all. That's when you truly love another. I'm sure of it.â€
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[color="Red"]Distance is to Love as Wind is to Fire...it extinguishes the small, and ignites the great. - Unknown[/color]
[color="RoyalBlue"]“Falling in love with someone isn't always going to be easy... Anger... tears... laughter.. It's when you want to be together despite it all. That's when you truly love another. I'm sure of it.â€
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Destroyer2000 - Posts: 1756
- Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 9:00 am
- Location: Fields of Athenry
I can say I'm the worst Christian on this forum.
My faith is so nonexistent that like Thomas, I won't believe a jot or tittle of anything written unless I actually see and hear Jesus and touch his wounds. I doubt the existence of any miraculous phenomena that can't be explained with science (i.e. physical resurrection of the dead, speaking of the tongues, prophecy, etc). All of the Bible can be written off as allegorical (St. Augustine believed the Creation in Genesis was an allegory, and this was CENTURIES before any in-depth scientific investigation in the origin of things). Maybe those who were "healed" in the Gospels and Acts were just removed of ill will within themselves, and the ones made to see were actually just removed of their ignorance. If all these naturally impossible phenomena are mere allegories, what of Christ? He'd just be another dead man among billions. And Christianity would have no importance or precedence over any other faith. Of course, you may have seen me cite references to the Bible when discussing morality. But if I knew the Qu'ran, Vedas and Upanishads I would have quoted them just as easily, because if Christianity is truly no different from them, then all other religions are just as valid. All religion becomes a means for people to function nicely and civily among each other. It would be, as Marx and others have said, a mere rationale for people to act the way they act to each other.
But I don't want to disbelieve anything I've learned! It's just that the Bible appears to crumble when put up against reality, as it were. Why do I feel compelled to believe? Is it because I was raised Christian? Is God real, or do I just want him to be? Do I just want purpose in this purposeless existence? We are born, we live, and we die--and the memory of our deeds vanish into the sea of time. Even the greatest individuals of our time had their stories obscured by myths and revisionist historians, such that no one can truly no what anyone did while they were alive. Why can't I just bring myself to be an Atheist or Muslim? What's wrong?
My faith is so nonexistent that like Thomas, I won't believe a jot or tittle of anything written unless I actually see and hear Jesus and touch his wounds. I doubt the existence of any miraculous phenomena that can't be explained with science (i.e. physical resurrection of the dead, speaking of the tongues, prophecy, etc). All of the Bible can be written off as allegorical (St. Augustine believed the Creation in Genesis was an allegory, and this was CENTURIES before any in-depth scientific investigation in the origin of things). Maybe those who were "healed" in the Gospels and Acts were just removed of ill will within themselves, and the ones made to see were actually just removed of their ignorance. If all these naturally impossible phenomena are mere allegories, what of Christ? He'd just be another dead man among billions. And Christianity would have no importance or precedence over any other faith. Of course, you may have seen me cite references to the Bible when discussing morality. But if I knew the Qu'ran, Vedas and Upanishads I would have quoted them just as easily, because if Christianity is truly no different from them, then all other religions are just as valid. All religion becomes a means for people to function nicely and civily among each other. It would be, as Marx and others have said, a mere rationale for people to act the way they act to each other.
But I don't want to disbelieve anything I've learned! It's just that the Bible appears to crumble when put up against reality, as it were. Why do I feel compelled to believe? Is it because I was raised Christian? Is God real, or do I just want him to be? Do I just want purpose in this purposeless existence? We are born, we live, and we die--and the memory of our deeds vanish into the sea of time. Even the greatest individuals of our time had their stories obscured by myths and revisionist historians, such that no one can truly no what anyone did while they were alive. Why can't I just bring myself to be an Atheist or Muslim? What's wrong?
Job 7:16
I loathe my life; I would not live forever. Let me alone, for my days are but a breath.
I loathe my life; I would not live forever. Let me alone, for my days are but a breath.
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Ingemar - Posts: 2244
- Joined: Sun Mar 28, 2004 12:43 pm
- Location: A Dungeon
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