Marriage Talks and Races relations

[Yahshua]

Eh lately with my conversation with my parents lately the conversation sometimes turn into the semi- seriousness nature of the talks for the marriage. The reason of being is that I am close to the magic age of marriage for my parents. When my father got marriage it was in his 29 years old. And I am close to that age now. And the frequency of the talks became more and more. And when it come to the marriage partner which my parents think I should get married my parents been a typical tradition Taiwanese parents often told me to get married to an American born Taiwanese or a Taiwanese international student. They as my parents want me to have an endogamy marriage relationship which endogamy is define as marriage within your own group of people instead of an exogamy marriage relationship which is define as marriage outside of your own group of people. And this leads to my argument with my parents. In my mind if I am going to lives in the United States of America and works here it is a good idea to married a “Whiteâ€

[bakura_fan]

I agree with you whole heartedly. If you marry someone with the same moral values as you (such as christian) and it's God's plan for you two to be together, I see no reason as to why race would be an issue. However, it seems your parents are quite set on their beliefs. . .my fear would be that if God placed you with a "white" woman, they would not treat her well at all. Tough situation. I'll be praying for ya!

[king atlantis]

no offence, your parents seem to be the shallow ones, and quite racist as well.

the color of ones skin =/= personality or morals, and basing on such is a very discriminating thing.
you should 'fall in love' or get married to whom ever God brings to you- wether they be 'white', 'black', 'asian', 'hispanic', or whatever.

also- tell them not to rush you to get married. its something that should take ALLONG time to come around. im talking...at the VERY VERY bare MINIMUM 1 year of dating. im hoping/planning on dating for around 3 years before i even CONSIDER marriage.

and...thats all. yup. and, i hope this doesnt insult you, i want to slap your parents.

And they wouldn’t learn the culture so it would be hard for them to communicate with her

mabey if they attempted to learn 'white girls' culture :mad:

[Mr. SmartyPants]

no offence, your parents seem to be the shallow ones, and quite racist as well.

the color of ones skin =/= personality or morals, and basing on such is a very discriminating thing.

With all due respect, King Atlantis, you ought to look at it from his parent's point of view. Many traditional family values are different between ethnicities, and a desire of continuance of those traditional family values is something that is bred into most people throughout their whole lives; especially in traditional Asian cultures. The desire to have your offspring to remain and stay in the same traditional culture that they grew up with is highly understandable, and I can respect their desire for that. And it is a true statistic that asian women learn towards commitment, especially in asian countries.

Look at the way outsiders view American girls: Sex-craving alcoholics that spent tons of money shopping. Now we all know this isn't 100% true, but we all know that many people are like this. Now, Yahshua's parents are not going to "learn" and accept what "white girl" culture is because they're old and busy with work and their own set of priorities. Are they going to be ignorant on this issue forever? Probably. Will the care? No. Does it even matter? Probably not. Heck, even I don't work well with your typical "white girl" culture and I'm in a university setting. Christian or not, I find a lot of your typical "American Eagle-loving, super-hot chick" type of girl to be rather uninteresting. They're very plastic and many times, rather unintelligent.

Evidently, I too also think about this matter. It's one of those "Do I want to date a Korean or a non-Korean?" phenomenas that pop into my mind. To be frank, each has their own pros and cons. Having a Korean mate would mean that there's potential for more in-depth conversation about cultural similarities and experiences, as well as having the solidarity of it. There would be an increase of Korean dining, and my mom would be able to talk with her more and relate with her better.

On the flip side, typical Korean girls are generally way more high-maintenance. No thanks. It's okay to be "bargain high-maintenance", but not regular high-maintenance. The potential for any unneeded stress in my life is something that I'd prefer to avoid.

Do I really care what ethnicity my spouse may be? Not really. Are there some repercussions for whichever I chose? Most definitely. Do they really matter? No, but I believe it is important to put them in perspective.

Either way, it's all about love. So go with whatever you desire, not your parents.

[Tsukuyomi]

All those points your parents argued.. those can be said about any race o.o It doesn't matter on the race. It depends on "that" person. I know some Asians that sleep around, who think they are better then others, who aren't that great with committing/being loyal to the family (I learned that again this past weekend >_>). Like with anything else in this word, there is both good and bad to this situation Try not to judge on only the bad things. Try not to clump anyone in one group. Try to look at them as individuals Not all "white" girls are like that ^ ^

Just remember, there's some good and some bad to everything ^_^ It's up to you who you want to marry. It shouldn't matter what race they are The only important things is that you love them and they love you, and of course that you two have some same views in life. Any little details like with learning your culture can be taken cared of as you two live your lives together ^ ^

(I hope that came out right o.o)

[ShiroiHikari]

I don't think you should marry someone just because they're Asian. What if you marry someone just because she's Taiwanese, but she turns out to be a bad match for you? People of every race can be bad. Your parents seem very narrow-minded, no offense. I would advise praying about it.

[Raiden no Kishi]

[quote="Yahshua (post: 1208052)"]Eh lately with my conversation with my parents lately the conversation sometimes turn into the semi- seriousness nature of the talks for the marriage. The reason of being is that I am close to the magic age of marriage for my parents. When my father got marriage it was in his 29 years old. And I am close to that age now. And the frequency of the talks became more and more. And when it come to the marriage partner which my parents think I should get married my parents been a typical tradition Taiwanese parents often told me to get married to an American born Taiwanese or a Taiwanese international student. They as my parents want me to have an endogamy marriage relationship which endogamy is define as marriage within your own group of people instead of an exogamy marriage relationship which is define as marriage outside of your own group of people. And this leads to my argument with my parents. In my mind if I am going to lives in the United States of America and works here it is a good idea to married a “Whiteâ€

[Mr. SmartyPants]

I really hate to sound like I'm promoting myself, but would some of you be willing to like... read my post before you start accusing other people or racism? I'm not saying that what Yahshua's parents are saying is right, but I can indeed understand where they're coming from. And really, I don't think most of you know what it's like to be in his position due to cultural differences in each other's upbringing.

[jaems-kun]

I really hate to sound like I'm promoting myself, but would some of you be willing to like... read my post before you start accusing other people or racism? I'm not saying that what Yahshua's parents are saying is right, but with all due respect, I don't think most of you know what it's like to be in his position due to cultural differences in each other's upbringing.

qft

[Tsukuyomi]

Rai brings up a very good point as well as others. You should get married when you're ready. You're parents aren't you. They don't know how you truly feel or what you will feel down the road. Lets say you do marry a traditional Taiwanese girl, and things do turn out sour. Who will the the one unhappy? You or them? Who are you marrying for? You or them? It is hard tho, because we're expected to respect our parents by doing "everything" they say. It's hard to deal with. That whole "Saving Face" bit u_u/

Respect is a "HUGE* thing when being Asian. Defying your parents means "Dishonor". Yes, we can say "Follow Your Heart", but it's not that simple.

To what King said.. It's true, most Asian folks are like that, but then you have to think about how they were brought up and whatnot. They are cultural differences to consider. They do have that sort of attitude, but then things are changing these days. Perhaps they think that way, because they have seen others act that way towards them. Just like they should learn the "White girl's way", the white girl should learn their ways as well.

[AsianBlossom]

Like MSP said, it's all about you and the girl who is best for you, not best for your parents. Granted, it's better in a relationship if your significant other gets along well with your family (as well as both families with each other) but it's your relationship that matters the most. And, as the whole thesis statement of this thread is, she just has to be a good, sweet girl who loves God. Right?

And I know I'm probably beating a dead...something, but girls are girls, and your going to have good ones and bad ones no matter what their ethnic background. You're going to have girls who make boyfriends out of every other guy they see; likewise, you're going to have girls who can't get a boyfriend who's white, Asian, or otherwise. We're all human and that's that.

Eh, sorry if that sounded a little ramblish...it's evening and I'm a little tired.

[Puguni]

I think people like to throw around the word "racist" a lot in America, when in fact they don't seem to take the time to understand the motive behind such reasoning.

I'm going to take a leap and say that the people who said, "racist" are white. You all and others really need to take the time to understand where Yahshua is coming from. MSP made a beautiful point about this, and I'm going to suggest people go back up to his post.

Asian parents are traditional. They want their children to have Asian children. I wouldn't put it out there that they are racist, per se, but rather, looking out for their family. I understand Yahshua's parents' thinking: they want him to marry someone they are familiar with culturally, rather than someone who is from a jarringly different culture. And...I think you guys just demonstrated how different our cultures are.

Marriage IS one the MOST important things in your life. It's something that should be meticulously planned. Can you imagine the culture shock if an average white girl married into an Asian family? I doubt love can save that.

---------------------------------------------------

HOWEVER. That doesn't mean I personally approve. If you find the right girl, you find the right girl. It doesn't matter who she is or what race. It just means you'll have to do more fighting for your love.

Ultimately...it lies with God.

[Fish and Chips]

I really hate to sound like I'm promoting myself, but would some of you be willing to like... read my post?

That's our Ryan. Ever the showman.

I've heard of parents preferring their children to marry within the ethnic pool. It's not particularly uncommon. Cultural (or religious) issues that can be stressful and dividing between two people from different world views, or perhaps just what they're used to]after[/I] you have found "Her," and preferably for reasons other than your own convenience.

[Yahshua]

Oh anyhow for the Practical reason that I am saying about to have a "White" Girl as a wife is that it create an cross culture bridge for me when I interacts with my "White" Co workers or when I socialize with them. Even thou I spend a lot of my life time here in the United States there are certain aspect of the American culture that I wouldn't pick up on since I am not a "White" person. So the "White" Girl as a wife can create a bridge for me to their social network world.

[Mr. SmartyPants]

Dan's parent's views, however, appear to stem not from these "Considerations" on behalf of their son, but their personal bias against foreign ethnicities. No matter how you cut it, it's both racist and derogatory, and I can't say they have your best interests in mind Dan. Making a decision will be difficult, because someone's going to get cut off one way or another, be it your potential wife or your parents.

It's most likely that their views do indeed stem from what they consider best for him (Having a wife of the same ethnicity). It's just that they use personal biases to further try and prove their original standpoint.

It's basically what my mom does, but she's generally nice about it.

[king atlantis]

To what King said.. It's true, most Asian folks are like that, but then you have to think about how they were brought up and whatnot. They are cultural differences to consider. They do have that sort of attitude, but then things are changing these days. Perhaps they think that way, because they have seen others act that way towards them. Just like they should learn the "White girl's way", the white girl should learn their ways as well.

cultural differences? you cant base culture on ones skin O_O'

not racist nor against cross-racial marriages, but I have to say I can't imagine myself falling in love and marrying, say, a Black woman.

mabey i was just born into a very open family or something...i could care less about skin or culture, as long as i got allong with said person. and realy, i could.

i dont know...it just seems so shallow to me. and about all that 'traditional' bull hockey...thats what it is. bull hockey. what if the 'asain' person grew up in an western country? shell act western. if she grew up in an eastern country? shell act as if she were.
its more of how/where you were raised than race. and even then...most people are very understanding of other cultures now-a-days, and most people *when getting married* should connect on a...deeper level than that, and find common similarities in many things, so it shouldnt realy be a problem :/

Oh anyhow for the Practical reason that I am saying about to have a "White" Girl as a wife is that it create an cross culture bridge for me when I interacts with my "White" Co workers or when I socialize with them. Even thou I spend a lot of my life time here in the United States there are certain aspect of the American culture that I wouldn't pick up on since I am not a "White" person. So the "White" Girl as a wife can create a bridge for me to their social network world.

were not all white in America Dan :/

plus, getting married for 'social' reasons =/= good idea, IMO.

so that the same cultures/traditions could be passed down even further.

and they cant do this when your married to someone of a different race...because?

<Mod Note: Remember that you can edit posts and use the multi-quote feature instead of double posting. Thanks!>

[Mr. SmartyPants]

Listen, boyo. Skin color has nothing to do with it. Most white people don't grow up the same way an asian or a black person grows up. Not only that, but Dan's parents are immigrants from another country, (I think) so their beliefs are deeply rooted into them.

It seems shallow to you because you can't understand the opposing viewpoint, which may further prove that cultural differences are significant.

A lot of people assume that there isn't much different between ethnicities (Immigrant or not) besides skin color and language. Not true at all.

and they cant do this when your married to someone of a different race...because?

I'd like you to go marry a Korean girl and try to comfortably assimilate yourself into her family's culture and mannerisms without any awkwardness. Face it, culture shock can be too overwhelming for some people.

[Yahshua]

Yes my family and I are the first generation immigrants to the United States.

[king atlantis]

Listen, boyo. Skin color has nothing to do with it. Most white people don't grow up the same way an asian or a black person grows up. Not only that, but Dan's parents are immigrants from another country, (I think) so their beliefs are deeply rooted into them

i cant say i have many friends from asian countries, but does mexico count for you? or how bout myself from england? plus, i have many friends who are black/indian/etc. cultures are gonna be different- but you shouldnt let that dictate your self.
i belive oyu can get allong, even fall in love, with people of other cultures, because of this:
we are all human underneither all the garbage society puts on.

It seems shallow to you because you can't understand the opposing viewpoint, which may further prove that cultural differences are significant.

yet i dont see you understanding mine(?)

A lot of people assume that there isn't much different between ethnicities (Immigrant or not) besides skin color and language. Not true at all

mabey thats why america is great...so many different types of people, all forced to get allong.
and, in the long run, end up likeing each other.
or, in some cases, marrying.

my point is this:
if you find someone you get allong with well enough to marry, cultures not gonna be much of a problem :/

Yes my family and I are the first generation immigrants to the United States.

just a question (if you dont mind answering, of course) when about did you move here(?)

[Yahshua]

When I was 12 at the Christmas of 1991.

[minakichan]

At the same time, do you actually have a "White Girl" in mind at all, someone you love who loves you back, and that you could see yourself with for the rest of your life and all that other stuff? If you don't, I don't think it should matter-- bring up the issue with your parents once it actually BECOMES an issue.

I'm Taiwanese too. My parents would have a fit if I wanted to marry a "Black Guy." I don't approve of that mentality, but I won't waste my time debating that with them.

To echo Fish, the way you quote "practicality" makes me wonder about your own intentions. You seem to be looking for a "White Girl" for the exact opposite reasons that your parents wouldn't want you to? If you're looking for happiness or even convenience, that's probably not the route to choose. Why a white girl? Why not any other race that your parents might equally disapprove of (my parents would definitely be less happy with me marrying a black man than a white)? Because white girls will give you an edge, living in America? I'm not sure that that's a better viewpoint than that held by your parents-- that there are inherent advantages in marrying a girl from one race than another.

[Mr. SmartyPants]

I never said it was impossible for interracial marriages to work out. All I am saying is that I can understand why Dan's parents would think that way.

yet i dont see you understanding mine(?)

Thank you for further proved my point. =) I don't agree with your viewpoints because I can understand where his parents are coming from.

[Radical Dreamer]

First of all, I think we all need to take a step back before this discussion gets too heated.

Secondly, King, I don't think anyone is disagreeing with you that people can be friends with or even marry people of other cultures and skin colors. I just think they're saying it's more difficult, and they're seeing the other side of the argument; perhaps not how things should be, but how things are and how they must be dealt with. Culture can cause something of a barrier in relationships, especially where parents are involved. I'm not against interracial marriage, but I do think that those who do marry someone of another race have a lot more problems to face, especially where I live.

Thirdly, King, there is an edit button and a multi-quote button. Please use them accordingly.

[king atlantis]

Thirdly, King, there is an edit button and a multi-quote button. Please use them accordingly.

sorry bout' that XD

i just feel very strongly on this subject, since
A) i know people who it has worked out for
B) i hate any form of racism, even IF its 'cultural'. why? becuase ive seen it first hand.
C) i dont think people should base their lives and happiness over what others think or make them.
D) i see no problems, only opportunities (ok, thats not true, but it sounds good, and i needed a D)

ill step back for now, ive stated my case. i wish you the best of luck Dan, to do what your heart and God deems as the correct path to go. however, one last warning:
NEVER go out or marry someone becuase it can get you higher up or better social 'skills', or your parents whant you too.. thats just BEGGING to end bad. you should TRULY love the said person, and, love comes with time; long after lust and first thoughts are passed away. :/

[EricTheFred]

I listen to this conversation, and the one thing that keeps going through my mind is... thank God that neither my wife's Asian family nor my Caucasian family inflicted this Devil's stew of stupidity on either one of us.

Yahshua,
A month ago, my wife and I celebrated twenty-one years of marriage. Our two children have relations on three continents and a cultural viewpoint as wide as the Earth itself. We confuse each other on a regular basis still, but we have a bond strong enough that it doesn't matter.

As for your parents' bizarre ideas about White girls, I can assure you it doesn't apply in the slightest to the three sisters I grew up with, or their daughters, or many good women I have met in the congregations I have worshipped with. None of the above are saints, but they are all good women. Every people of Earth have in their number a core of good, moral individuals. You simply cannot make an assumption about anyone's character based upon their culture or ethnic.

[Tsukuyomi]

Sometimes it can be like how men want sons. Why? To carry their name of course. I think that's why Asian parents want their children to marry other Asians. To preserve their "race" Yes, I said the "R" word :| You must also admit that not only Asians think this way. There are other "races" that think this way to. I say this, because I've seen it. It even goes as far as "You can't go play with her because she's Asian". People rag on things they don't understand, and that in terns makes the "ragged", rag on others. It's a vicious cycle that should really stop u_u

Another thing about "preservation". I have seen some cross-racial marriages, and in some of them, one cultural is forgotten. Maybe that's why people don't approve of it, and this would be one of "the problems to face". Instead of integrating the two "cultures". One tends to be left out.

Daaaaaaaaaaan, is that the reason why you want to marry a "white girl" O__O It may seem that way on the outside of the situation to you, but is that really the case here? Say if I marry a "white guy" is that going to automatically put me in the same "social network* as him? Not necessarily. Just because I'm married to a white guy doesn't mean I'm going to be accepted, by his "social network".You can be still be in the "social network" even if you don't marry a white girl, or black girl, or asian girl, or whatever.

No matter who you marry, you're still going to be you. Just, be sure you love her and she loves you and you both have the deep connection leading you two to God ^_^

(If any of that is stepping on anybodies toes. It wasn't meant to be ^_^ If it was unnecessarily, then feel free to delete this ^ ^)

[Roy Mustang]

I really hate to sound like I'm promoting myself, but would some of you be willing to like... read my post before you start accusing other people or racism? I'm not saying that what Yahshua's parents are saying is right, but I can indeed understand where they're coming from. And really, I don't think most of you know what it's like to be in his position due to cultural differences in each other's upbringing.

Ryan hit the nail on the head. I dated a Chinese girl a few years back and her family was the same way. Also, the cultural difference were big for the both of us. We end up as just good friends and I didn't agree with the views of her family. I did respect their traditional family values.

[font="Book Antiqua"][color="Red"]Col. Roy Mustang
[/color]
[/font]

[Tsukuyomi]

It's the worst when something like that happens u_u I have a friend who "ALMOST" let that stand in her way of being with her boyfriend. She was almost about to break up with her boyfriend because her parents were giving her such a hard time about it

[Raiden no Kishi]

For the record, I understand that it's a cultural thing, and that it's a very different mindset than many of us have. I understand reconciling the two would be very difficult.

However, blanket judgments of "white" girls are racist. I won't compromise on that. Deeply-held, culturally-based, or whatever. Hey, racism was part of the culture in the States in the past, too. There were (and still are, I imagine) people who hold very strongly to such views. Change was and is required. That applies to all situations and all cultures where such unfair views exist. Do such matters need to be handled diplomatically? Absolutely. However, there are places to stand firm and unmoving. That's my point in its entirety. Racism is racism is racism whatever the context. The context only determines how it should be addressed. The fact that it must be addressed is self-evident.

.rai//

[Fish and Chips]

Ryan, I'm half inclined to read your "Understanding" of this scenario as "Culture excuses anything." And while I'm sure that's not the case, this discussions is heading down into debate territory, so I'll drop it at that.