CAA: Christian Anime Alliance

Lets us discuss the Classics! If you read the classics, post here which you are reading now, which are your favorites, why, favorite authors, favorite generas, even how you think the Classics influence or should influence Manga.

SDG

How would you define classics?

LOL Good question, I am personally referring to the high literature that is generally accepted as such. Meaning such works as from Austen, Tolstoy, and Dickens. Books that are generally accepted as classics for generations and for generations to come.

SDG

I consider it my life goal to finish reading Les Misérables before I'm 30. XD I'm about 1/5 of the way there! It's an excellent story, and a fascinating read so far.

I also LOVE The Three Musketeers by Alexandre Dumas, and it's another life goal of mine to finish reading The Count of Monte Cristo before too long, too. XD

I'm sure there are a lot more; classic lit is mostly what I read on my own during high school (though I may also be confusing my "I've read this" list with my "I really want to read this" list XD). Either way, those are the ones that stick out for now! XD

I've read Pride and Prejudice for classes twice, but I can't get past the first 90 pages. Austen's prose may be satirical, but that doesn't change the fact that its tediousness makes the book a chore. I'm much more of a Bronte girl. Charlotte Bronte, specifically. She wrote Jane Eyre and was pretty much like "Jane Austen, I see what you did there, but I'm going to be the complete opposite of you." It makes me happy, XD. I also have Wuthering Heights by Emily Bronte, but I haven't really read it.

I greatly enjoyed To the Lighthouse by Virginia Woolf. I couldn't stand stream of conscious writing when I had to read James Joyce's A Portrait of the Artist as a Young Man, but I absolutely love the way Woolf does it. I'd like to read more of her fiction someday.

I, too, will one day finish Les Mis. When that day comes, it will be the longest book I have ever read.

I also like:
The Mayor of Casterbridge by Thomas Hardy
Lady Windermere's Fan by Oscar Wilde
Pygmalion by Bernard Shaw
Heart of Darkness by Joseph Conrad
Waiting For Godot by Samuel Beckett
The Crucible by Arthur Miller
Ethan Frome by Edith Wharton
East of Eden, The Pearl, and Of Mice and Men by John Steinbeck. I also have a collection of his short stories that I have yet to read and I want to read The Grapes of Wrath
Twelfth Night and Hamlet by Shakespeare, although I've read A Midsummer Night's Dream and most of Romeo and Juliet

Then there's the Greek stuff like Oedipus, Antigone (I haven't read the one in between, though, XD), The Illiad, The Odyssey (although I've never read the full texts of either), and Aristophanes' plays. Lysistrata is probably my favorite; it's very funny.

/English major

Hm, the majority of my favorites come from the 20th century, so I am not sure if Evelyn Waugh, G.K. Chesterton, C.S. Lewis, Jorge Luis Borges, Frederich Buechner, Shusaku Endo, Graham Greene or the like qualify.

Out of the older stuff, it is hard to dislike the epics poems. Milton's Paradise Lost is an easy pick. So is Alighieri's Divine Comedy, but the cultural gap is larger, making it more difficult for me to truly appreciate it.

Out of the plays, Shakespeare's tragedies, particularly Hamlet, strike my fancy. The Greeks have a lot of great stories as well, although my memories of them are hazy enough that I don't dare pick a favorite --outside of giving a special tip of the hat to Euripides and his gritty portrayals.

In the realm of non-fiction, there are many great philosophical works. I, unfortunately, haven't read many of them to completion, but S. Kierkegaard always gets an honored mention. The theologians are fascinating reads as well. Virtually every major religious writing falls under your description of a "Classic", so I won't even try to list them all.

As for Novels, there is Notes from Underground by Dostoevsky. As well as the works of Mark Twain and H.G. Wells (especially The Island of Dr. Moreau, which is closer to horror than science fiction). Oddly enough, I don't think I have read many novels written prior to the 1900's.

Short fiction has great representatives in Arthur Conan Doyle, H.P. Lovecraft, and Edgar Allen Poe. The mystery, science fiction, and horror genres have much to owe to them, while I owe them many a fine evening's enjoyment.

For Poetry, you will have to talk to someone else, I am afraid.

I consider it my life goal to finish reading Les Misérables before I'm 30. XD I'm about 1/5 of the way there! It's an excellent story, and a fascinating read so far.

Ah, that is a truly tough novel. I just started it a month ago, intending on marathoning my way through in a few weeks, but work and Hugo's darn writing style got in the way. I am only a small way into the recounting of the Battle of Waterloo, at the moment.

I like the story well enough, but considering the way he writes I can only conclude that he was paid by the word. As I go through the novel, he will set up these beautiful scenes, and write in glorious prose. He will capture the essence of a mood or thought perfectly through some indirect method (such as the image of Jean Valjean pacing in his room, trying to decide whether to turn himself in and give up his position as mayor, as told from the servant's point of view), and I will say to myself "now that is why this is a classic". Then he will spend the next fifty pages recounting (and trampling all over) the same scene in the most dry manner possible.

You know all of those tricks you learn during NaNoWriMo to boost your word count? You know, making huge lists that add nothing to the story, going off on tangents about whatever enters your mind (even if they aren't related to the story), retelling the same encounter from a bunch of different perspectives, and all that? Victor Hugo new all of those tricks too, and he applies them liberally.

Frankly, I am still trying to decide whether it is worth finishing or not. I could be reading so many other, more efficient books right now.

Hmmm. I have a lot that I adore, such as
The Crucible (mentioned above- and high five for that!)
Most anything Shakespeare. It's just.... yes.
Dr. Faustus by Chrstopher Marlowe (though I don't care for anything else by him). This really got me because it could be interpreted in so many ways- I took it as mideval man vs. Enlightenment man, but everyone in my class seemed to get something different from it!
The Scarlet Letter by Nathaniel Hawthorne- simple and to the point once you get past the intro. A beautiful love story, with it thwarted, for the most part (what makes it so tragic! ) And with so much on whether she should have been faithful, whether it was fair for her husband to have been declared dead, how right it was for her and the pastor/preacher to be in love....
Brave New World by Aldous Huxley. Read in the 8th grade, and at that point I was discovering so much about the world- it was as relevant to the modern society then as it was when it was written. How human are we, dependence on drugs, innurment to what makes us human... I got so much out of it! I really have to reread it now that I'm older....
Catch 22 by Joseph Heller. My first truly dark comedy. Also 8th grade reading (on my own, I don't think my parents would have let me read half the books I did if they knew i was checking them out of the library!). This made me laugh and cry. There was so much about the complexities of love, how ineffective command can be - I took it as a criticism on most big groups, since I was also paying attention to the politics at my mom's workplace, and noticed quite a few similarities >.>" But it was also about people, and... Well.

and a few others I can't think of at the moment!

As for the classics affecting anime or manga, well.... I just can't see that many classics going over to that medium without reimagining, like was done for Ponyo or Romeo x Juliet. In fact, I'd say that those shows are a blending of East and West- I seem to remember a Japanese version of the Little Mermaid, and the love story between two people who shouldn't is also fairly universal. I can see the Western versions adding themes or ideas to what's already there, but what the Japanese have in terms of those stories seems universal enough to cross cultural boundaries. Should they influence anime/manga? It's undeniable that they will as countries become more entwined in this global community. And things like revenge and redemption make for great stories (which is why I would love to see an anime version of MacBeth!), But I don't see them ever going onscreen as they are- they'd almost definitely be reinterpreted to reflect Eastern influences, or just appeal to more people (since I imagine a lot of the people who enjoy anime don't read Shakespeare).

ich1990 (post: 1402379) wrote:Ah, that is a truly tough novel. I just started it a month ago, intending on marathoning my way through in a few weeks, but work and Hugo's darn writing style got in the way. I am only a small way into the recounting of the Battle of Waterloo, at the moment.

Yeah, I think I had just reached the end of that part when I put it down last, actually! XD School got in the way, along with trips to the bookstore. XD Still, I figure it'll be well worth the read in the end. Also, I totally agree about the scene where Valjean is pacing, debating with himself over whether or not he'll turn himself in. I LOVED that scene so much, and Hugo wrote it in a way that made it completely relatable, even two hundred years later. XD If the rest of the book has any more writing like that, I will definitely consider it 100% worth it! XD

LadyRushia wrote:I want to read The Grapes of Wrath

My dad said that he tried to read that book when he was in college and it was hands-down the worst thing he's ever read.

ich wrote:Milton's Paradise Lost is an easy pick.

I love Paradise Lost because when you get right down to it, it's nothing more than Bible fanfiction that somehow got accepted as canon by the church. It'd be like me using some 13 year old's SasuNaru fanfic as proof that Naruto and Sasuke are totally gay for each other in the show.

My mind just reels at it.

I'd like to contribute more but I'm still not sure how we're defining "classics." Unless it's Mark Twain's definition, "something that everybody wants to have read and nobody wants to read."

Nate (post: 1402554) wrote:I love Paradise Lost because when you get right down to it, it's nothing more than Bible fanfiction that somehow got accepted as canon by the church.

I know, right? I especially liked the part when the ravening horde of demons look at each and ask themselves why they are fighting with swords and arrows when they could just take a few minutes and invent something better. So, they build cannons.

I'd like to contribute more but I'm still not sure how we're defining "classics." Unless it's Mark Twain's definition, "something that everybody wants to have read and nobody wants to read."

While Twain (along with Ambrose Bierce) can always be counted on to provide a solid definition, if you look at the third post, you can see the thread maker gave us the following guidelines:

1) High literature that is generally accepted as such, like Austen, Tolstoy, or Dickens. So, popular works that are generally considered classics. I imagine that any of the Penguin Classics or Harvard Classics would fall under this category.

2) Has been accepted as a classic for generations. This is a little vague, so I interpreted it as meaning it has been around for more than a hundred years.

3) Will be accepted as a classic for generations to come. I always find it taxing to employ my time traveling skills, so I just ignored this clause.

ich1990 wrote:I know, right? I especially liked the part when the ravening horde of demons look at each and ask themselves why they are fighting with swords and arrows when they could just take a few minutes and invent something better. So, they build cannons.

But then they realize that they're metaphysical beings and swords and arrows and cannons can't hurt them so they get bored and watch TV.

1) High literature that is generally accepted as such, like Austen, Tolstoy, or Dickens. So, popular works that are generally considered classics. I imagine that any of the Penguin Classics or Harvard Classics would fall under this category.

Hmm, okay. That makes sense, although the problem is that what's generally accepted as classics? Is there like...a master list somewhere that's all "These authors are hereby considered to be classics?" I mean, not even Wikipedia has an article on "Books considered to be classical literature" and they have stuff like "Video games considered to be the worst ever."

2) Has been accepted as a classic for generations. This is a little vague, so I interpreted it as meaning it has been around for more than a hundred years.

Anything by John Steinbeck is out by that definition, though.

3) Will be accepted as a classic for generations to come. I always find it taxing to employ my time traveling skills, so I just ignored this clause.

Yeah I don't see how that one would work either. What we consider to be a classic that will stand the test of time sometimes doesn't pan out that way.

The only thing I've read that's even close to a classic then, I guess, would be The Picture of Dorian Gray. Which is pretty good honestly, although the middle where all Wilde does is describe the passions that Dorian devotes himself to is pretty boring and unnecessary.

Nate, I am honestly sick of seeing you come into every thread to nitpick every little thing. It does nothing to add to the discussion at hand. If you want to argue definitions, then please do it somewhere else. Consider this an official warning.

Back on topic, maybe classic children's lit would make for better/easier to adapt anime material. Two books that come to mind are The Animal Family and The 21 Balloons.

Nate (post: 1402570) wrote:Anything by John Steinbeck is out by that definition, though.

Of Mice and Men is definitely a classic. Amazing novel.

Wow! So many amazing comments! XD So cool! I just want to quote everyone!!! XD But I know that I can't. I did note here and there that, wow, yeah there are so many different classics and that effect people differently which I think is so cool! And it seems there is a fond memory for some classic or another. Which seems to go also for Anime and Manga too. Fun!!!
Personally, I had actually found, even as a poet myself, Paradise Lost to be the most difficult classic to read! To this day I cannot finish it. O.o LOL
Also, I am a huge Jane Austen fan and I love the Russian authors Tolstoy and Dostoevsky. All of whom have incredibly influenced my own works. And for an indepth story with a constant twisting plot, then War and Peace is perfect!!! I love recommending that book!!! Oh and I loved Dr. Faustus myself but also for my own reason! LOL I thought that book so perfectly described man's wicked soul and his desperate need for God! The whole story is worth just the conclusion!
Oh and I cannot speak highly enough for Les Miserables! What a work! What a piece! What moral and philosophic depth! I cried at the end of that book! Wow! it was incredible!
I have seen the works that are, at least, inflluenced by western works. Romeo x Juliet looks exceedingly fascinating to me! I really really want to watch that one! And I really really really hope Romeo and Juliet don't die. That would be depressing. LOL I have also seen a work, The Count of Monte Cristo in Anime. Being an adaptation of the classic, it seems promising! I like seeing the Eastern take on these Western works... really intriguing!

SDG

Atria35 (post: 1402409) wrote:Brave New World by Aldous Huxley.

In total agreement. Brave New World is an amazing novel that has great depth to it. Definitely a classic for the ages.

Of course The Count of Monte Cristo needs to be mentioned. It tells a tale of justice and revenge, and does so most beautifully. There is also The Great Gatsby, with its themes of love, wealth, and power, and how each can be an influence on one another. Finally, there is also The Catcher in the Rye. Yes, I could've done without some of the language, but I can't help but feel sympathetic towards the main character. A tale of self-discovery, of trying to find one's way in the world, and of trying to live an authentic life, it is a great work.

I was going to add a lot, but I timed out when I found this site:

http://www.literature.org/authors/

And began reading various Arthur Conan Doyle novels. XD

Ah yes, I forgot about The Great Gatsby. I liked that one. I've also gotten a little ways into To Kill a Mockingbird, but I will probably have to start from the beginning when I pick it up again because it's been so long.

And you can't forget the Arthurian Romances! ^_^

SDG

I'm currently reading Les Mis but I'm pretty sure I have some sort of abridged version. It doesn't have any of the dry stuff in it and it's not a giant tome. This is one of those rare cases where I am A-OK with a book being abridged. I'm enjoying it very much.

As for other "classics", I really like old children's novels, like The Secret Garden, A Little Princess, and Anne of Green Gables. They're such wonderful stories.

I also plowed through Tess of the d'Urbervilles, and enjoyed it for the most part but it was really freaking depressing.

I read Jane Eyre once, but I forgot what happened so I need to read it again.

I like the story of Pride and Prejudice, but I don't like the book. If that makes sense.

ShiroiHikari (post: 1402624) wrote:I like the story of Pride and Prejudice, but I don't like the book. If that makes sense.

ooh! It wasn't the BBC version you saw then was it!? LOL I thought that was the most faithful to the book!

SDG

I like the 2005 movie with Keira Knightley a lot. It's not the most faithful but all the really important stuff is there in a nice, neat little package. I hate the book itself because it's dry as a bone. I've never been able to get past the first couple of chapters.

Dry! O.o Wow! OK. lol But yeah, when I watch to 2005, I felt like I was going through the story at Warp Speed! LOL Felt like I was out of breath at the end! LOL

SDG

To each his own. XD

I'm probably the only Dickens fan on here. I also like Hawthorne, Twain, Poe, and Shakespeare.

Atria35 (post: 1402409) wrote:The Scarlet Letter by Nathaniel Hawthorne- simple and to the point once you get past the intro. A beautiful love story, with it thwarted, for the most part (what makes it so tragic! ) And with so much on whether she should have been faithful, whether it was fair for her husband to have been declared dead, how right it was for her and the pastor/preacher to be in love....

That’s funny, because it would never, ever have occurred to me to view The Scarlet Letter primarily as a love story. I suppose it just goes to show that a truly great work can be viewed from many different angles. As for myself, I see it as being more about sin and redemption, and the different effects of public expiation versus hidden guilt. Great book, though, especially in the psychological insight into the lives of Dimmesdale and Chillingworth.

I would also list Hawthorne as a favorite author, partly for The Scarlet Letter and partly because he has some really great short stories.

PatrickEklektos wrote: I love the Russian authors Tolstoy and Dostoevsky.

Seconded. Their most famous works are very good, though not everything is of the same quality. My personal favorites from those two would be Crime and Punishment, Notes from Underground, and The Death of Ivan Ilych.

PatrickEklektos wrote: And you can't forget the Arthurian Romances!

Yes, those are really interesting—it’s fascinating to see how the legends of King Arthur change over time. I particularly enjoyed the romances of Chrétien de Troyes.

Other favorite authors of mine would include Shakespeare (Hamlet, Macbeth, Lear, A Midsummer Night’s Dream), Spenser (Faerie Queene), Dante, Conrad (Heart of Darkness), and probably several others I’m forgetting. George Orwell also deserves an honorable mention: 1984 had a huge impact on me when I read it back in high school, and Animal Farm is great, too.

For short stories, I like Flannery O’Connor, Hawthorne (as mentioned above), and Isak Dinesen, though whether the rich, splendidly convoluted stories in Dinesen’s Seven Gothic Tales can truly be called “shortâ€

Wow! That is awesome! I never met so many people who liked Hawthorne! That is sooo cool!!! Kaori, have you read "The Celestial Railroad"? If you have read "Agustin's Confessions" (brilliant work btw and a personal favorite), then you have probably read Pilgrims Progress! After reading PP, then you must read The Celestial Railroad! It is so perfect and, ironically, pictures and portrays the modern church perfectly!
Crime and Punishment is excellent but I am still working through it!

Hey, am I the only one here who writes notes and observations in the margins of my books... especially in Classics?

SDG

I actually hate marking up books. I had to do it in high school and it never worked too well for me. I tend to just do all the analyzing and note taking in my head.

PatrickEklektos (post: 1402857) wrote:Kaori, have you read "The Celestial Railroad"? If you have read "Agustin's Confessions" (brilliant work btw and a personal favorite), then you have probably read Pilgrims Progress! After reading PP, then you must read The Celestial Railroad! It is so perfect and, ironically, pictures and portrays the modern church perfectly!

Yes, I have, and Pilgrim's Progress also. "The Celestial Railroad" is a terrific story, not a little chilling in its satire.

Hey, am I the only one here who writes notes and observations in the margins of my books... especially in Classics?

These days, if I mark in a text, it is usually to help me find something again--I will sometimes underline or otherwise mark passages I find noteworthy, usually in pencil, so that I can easily find them again later; I find that too much marking up of a text is distracting the next time I try to read the book.

Off-topic, but PatrickEklektos, your avatar is awesome.

I don't write in my books. I do however make bookmarks out of toilet paper.


...What?

ShiroiHikari (post: 1403086) wrote:I do however make bookmarks out of toilet paper.

I thought that was universal...?