CAA: Christian Anime Alliance

Dear all,

I've been hanging out at other forums and noticed how the moment an openly acclaimed Christian voices his/her opinions on something controversial, they get "whacked" up pretty badly by the community. While it's fine to get persecuted (o.0), what greatly bothers me is how Christians back off from the topic straight away in the face of hostility, instead of staying strong to their opinions. It's like..."yeah, I said that but OK since someone's mad, I'll rephrase my comment..."

I don't intend to judge others. I'm looking at myself instead. Now, what can I do about myself as a Christian? "What would "I" do in the face of conflict?" Would I retreat and say, "Please don't hate me." or "Would I dare bring forth more Christian reasonings?" "Or do I lack spiritual wisdom to defend God in the first place?"

Or should I even bother? Is it worth getting into a debate? I'm confused and deeply saddened with myself. I don't want to cause trouble but at the same time, I feel it's my/our responsibility to defend our faith and God's Law.

I can't help getting flustered seeing non-believers get all smirky and proud that they've managed to "beat" Christians in controversial debates in public forums. "Hah, I know the bible more than you! It's Ok to _______. " ARRRGHHH!!! I can't stand it!

And yet, I feel scared of getting into a debate coz I'm not very strong in debates or my knowledge, and my personality just isn't pro-conflict. I grew up yearning for as few conflicts as possible in my life but I think the more serious I get with my faith, I won't be able to avoid it. Just recently, eversince my fellowship dissolved, I've been more exposed to non-believing communities and almost every week, I realized I've been debating with my non-believer pals about controversial topics...(E.g. the recent San Francisco thingy) and I realized how inadequate I am in defending my faith.

I thought, "OK I must increase my knowledge and wisdom in my faith, but sometimes I feel, it's impossible coz there's just too much! There's so much to learn..how am I going to learn everything enough to be able to defend my faith adequately?"

While I'll always find refuge in Christian communities like CAA, I know I'll have to step out of that comfort zone but I don't really know to prepare myself.

Thoughts, opinions? I hope this topic is appropriate here coz I feel despaired at my weakness and inadequacy and would like to know how others have dealt with this.

Actually, what I've found intriguing is how people seem to feel threatened by Christianity, as if it's a great deep dark maw of joylessness or some threat to life and limb that must be contained.

I often have trouble following debates; even at Anime Angels you'll find me posting only very rarely in the discussion threads. Maybe that's because long complicated explanations of things (which I don't always have time to read) leave me rather confused, but I think that it's also because I often take a really long time to come up with a response (and by then someone else has already responded ).

I feel like I have more to say, but I need to think about it some more first.

As a general rule, I think people should stay out of debates unless they are adequately prepared. Your position may be right on, but if you lose the debate it just reinforces the confidence that the other side has that they are right. Apologetics is field that some people devote their whole lives to. If you feel the need to enter into a debate arm yourself with some of their works so you don't enter in empty handed.

As far as backing down goes, unless you feel that your original statement was actually wrong I think it's bad thing to do. It may be better to rephrase your position though. Some people just don't like certain words, replacing them with words of equivalent meaning may help to defuse hostile situations when people take offense.

The best idea is to steer clear of that kinda thing. Always the best idea.

If you get into it though, don't start spouting out religious quotes from the bible. Your best bet is just to post what you feel in your heart and not in a book, where the true source of religion is. If you do, people can just look at that and not give it much thought. Words from the heart are heeded more than words read from a book.

Finally, the best thing to do when people attack your religion is NOT to attack the other person's beliefs. This just causes a big fight and you could most likely be banned from a forum. As well as it shows the person that you have more tolerance for that kinda thing and you won't sink down to thier level. Besides, do unto others that you would do unto yourself.

And that is my three cents. I put in a extra paragraph for good measure, pip pip. I haven't really followed my own advice, especially with athiests that just give angsty reasons why the religion is bad. You might not like the words that I said, but I don't really care.

I remember being involved with a lot of debates on the AnimeNation forums. I was one of the only Christians there, and sometimes it got a bit hard. What was even worse was when someone would make a thread asking about other Christian Anime fans on the boards and others would invade the thread and start trashing us.

It was one reason I was so glad to find CCA. I hadn't even realized before that Christian anime boards existed... O_o;;;

-Iapetus

What a cool sig by the way! What is it from?

I'm not bad at debate, I prefer to just explain though. Ya know? But yeah, I don't mind the defending part. I agree though that you need to be prepared.

Personally, I’m a debater by nature, and I enjoy intellectual fencing. But this thread is not about me.

I think, on the internet, you would be fine in not engaging in debates. What you will accomplish is relatively minor, compared to what could be lost. Among friends in real life, however, I wouldn’t suggest keeping silent for too long. One part of Christianity is being able to defend your faith.

Hmm… I doubt that was very helpful.

I used to like to debate, but anymore I just don't see the point. *lost too many times XD* And usually, by the time I get to one of those threads, somebody already said what I was gonna say anyway.

However, I think it would be good to be able to defend yourself if you (or someone you're close to) is attacked. Lord knows I need some help with that myself. e.e

Don't be sad ; _ ; Just pray about it. I'm sure that God will help you know what to say at the right times.

nighthedgehog wrote:The best idea is to steer clear of that kinda thing. Always the best idea.

I disagree. I believe that part of our duty as christians is to help others to see the light. Naturally, there are times when starting a theological debate would be inappropriate, as it can cause a lot of friction between people.

I used to have an athiest friend at school who like to argue about God with me, and I was okay with that (especially since me and my other smart christian friends had him outnumbered ). However, I'm not the type of person who would invade someone's privacy by forcing that kind of debate on them. I know my mom can't stand it when people come by the house trying to convert her, so the golden rule pretty much prohibits that one

Anyway, before I get too offtrack with this post, I'd say the best thing is to be prepared to defend your faith when it is challenged. There is almost nothing worse (evangelically speaking) than for someone to come up to you and say 'why are you a christian?' and for you to be like, 'ummmm... I just am, I guess...... uh... and it makes me feel fuzzy.' lol

There is a lot of material available for you to defend your christianity with if it comes to a debate, and as Viking said, you should do some reasearch and arm yourself with these if you get stuck. I, for one, feel pretty good about debates on forums or email, because I can always go get some reading material to form a good answer to any particular question, whether its from the libarary, my mom, 'The Catachism of the Roman Catholic Church', or good ol' Google

The tricky thing is real-time debates, like over IM or especially in real life... I worry about not being able to think up a good answer quick enough.

I regret that I only have a few minutes to respond at the moment (and I will probably end up expanding upon it later), but speaking as someone who has been involved in more than his fair share of debates with believers and nonbelievers alike, I will give you my advice.

First, don't attempt it unless you are prepared. The only thing worse that saying nothing at all is darting in with John 14:6 one-liners when discussing complex issues with nonbelievers. Most people will either ignore you, or do their best to turn you into mush (which, 9 times out of 10, they will be able to do if all you can do is quote John 14:6 to them).

Still, you don't have to back down unless you genuinely made a mistake. That is the second annoying thing I see Christians do in these situations. Since they can't defend their real beliefs, they just keep taking weaker and weaker positions until they have nothing left to say. As you can imagine, this is very harmful to their faith, and very unproductive in terms of evangelism/apologetics.

The two most important things to be familiar with if you want to be able to defend your beliefs are the Bible, and basic logic. Obviously you want to read your bible regularly for this purpose, so that you can respond to false doctrine. For the second, I would recommend "Introduction to Philosophy: A Christian Perspective," by Norman Geisler to start.

Ok, my time is up, so I will only say one more thing. Don't be intimidated by nonbelievers who quote bible verses to you, or try to stun you with "contradictions" between passages. More likely than not, they are paraphrasing (or copying-and-pasting) from someone else's site, having never read the bible themselves. Luckily, you can do this right back at them if necessary. I would suggest www.carm.org as a starting point, or the booke "When Critics Ask," by Norman Geisler.

Cephas wrote:I've been there, girlfriend (hope you don't mind the West Coast slang). I would advise you NOT to share your Christian beliefs in a decidedly-secular forum.

I certainly don't mind the slang...^^

The problem is some forums I'm referring to are actually "Christian", not secular.... So I get very miffed with non-believers coming into these forums, start trashing around and flaunting their lifestyles. And most Christians back down...which is sad, coz the forum supposed to be safe grounds, not a battlefield for them.

..uh, i think it's quite unfair to think that ALL non-believers in "secular" boards are out to "attack" Christians. believe me, not all non-believers who join debates join for the sake of bashing Christianity to bits, although that does seem to be the general impression because so many non-believers are doing it. i've met some non-believers who really honestly join debates for intellectual reasons and not for the fixated reason of getting a "high" out of bashing Christians, and i respect them very much for that.

best tip i can give is that before you join a potentially-controversial Christian debate, check out the person who brought it up. some people bring up debates for the rather pathetic reason of busting some chops - they're really just there to look for a fight, and you know very well that that sort of "debate" would really be going nowhere because the reason for bringing up that debate had never been intellectual. some, however, do have good intentions and they really do just want to know as much as possible, and that can be a chance for you. however, yes, you must be confident enough in your caliber before joining such debates. mindlessly jumping into a debate that was meant to be intellectual would be an insult to the people who brought it up. remember, you don't join debates to go around proving how smart you are: among the people involved the debate, it's already an assumption that you're smart enough to handle it.

my personal rule in joining debates: be proactive, not reactive.

I have quite a bit to say on the subject, and will post more later. That said, I agree with CB that CARM is a great site (that I haven't visited in a long time, I have to go there). Two things to keep in mind: Pray without ceasing, and evaluate the nature of the question/challenge. If the question is a sincere one that you can't answer right away, ask them if you can sleep on it and compose a reasoned answer, and get back to them in a timely manner after consulting scripture and helpful sources like Christian friends or websites like CARM. If their question is merely one designed to one-up you, or is from a proud heart rather than a sincere one, then call them on the nature of their question, ask them if you could get back to them when you've thought about it, and give them the gospel instead. Most people don't malign Christ, so use that and talk about how much Jesus loves them. Remember that winning an argument is NOT the most important thing. I have won many arguments that I know in retrospect were a waste of time because I didn't get those people any closer to Christ. If you know that you will not get them closer to Christ by arguing with them, then don't waste your time arguing, either change the subject to the gospel, or spend your time praying.

I hope this is helpful to you.

Just know what is allowed in the forums where you are posting.

I love to debate, and I've been slapped with the Ban Threat several times being told to go somewhere else.

I try to hold back some comments here, and refrain from starting up certain subjects.

It really depends on where you are when you start arguing/debating.
And yeah, it helps if you have a good grasp on what you're talking about.

Well i'm not sure if this is the BEST way to handle it but it has worked for me in the past. When I am on a non-christian board and there is a contraversial issue or someone talking about christianity I don't barge in and get all preachy. If some one is attacking my faith I just let them know what I believe. I don't cram it down their throat as the absalute truth (although it is) but I state it as my opinion. I like to stear clear of debate and conflict but I DO NOT run from it. I would also follow up my "opinion" with leting people know that if they have questions about the topic or my views on it then they can PM me or something. This way if we do have a debate it is not over the whole board to be victim of anyone who wants to trash my faith. I can do a lot better one-on-one with people than taking on all at once.

But if someone is attacking your faith then the most important this is not to make sure they don't end up feeling their right, it is to make sure you don't believe they are right. Non-blelievers and athiests can ask some hard questions and some christians can even answer them for themselves. If this happens then make sure you find the answers because to any question about God, christianity, religion, there is an answer. Ask your pastor, perents, friends, people on CAA, even me! Just get the answers. Also if someone asks you a question in a debate that you jusy have no idea how to answer it is better to admit that you don't know and tell them you will find the answer (as long as you actualy do) than just give some flimzy answer that almost makes sence.

But then underlining thing is this. God is your father. Its not about religion, rules, or anything like that it's about your relationship with God. And what would you do if one of your friends started telling you that your ACTUAL father didn't really exist? It is always best to make things simple. So thats what I have to say about that. If you have questions about my post then PLEASE ask me. I might be totaly wrong on some points here too.

Good words, Malic.

I used to debate a lot with nonbelievers in Christian forums, or even believers who were looking for a fight about doctrine or whatever. I look back on that, and it makes me sad. As far as I know, I NEVER led a person closer to Christ by debating.... but I may have looked like a jerk and pushed people further away from Christianity.

My advice would be this: Be strong in your faith. Do not apologize for it. But do not be drawn into pointless debates. God does not need you to defend Him.

You will probably be ridiculed... but we can't say that Jesus never warned us. "If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first. If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you. Remember the words I spoke to you: 'No servant is greater than his master.' If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also." (John 15:18-20)

"He was led like a sheep to the slaughter,
and as a lamb before the shearer is silent,
so he did not open his mouth." (Acts 8:32)

Jesus didn't feel the need to defend Himself when He was unjustly reviled. I don't think we should feel the need to defend Him either... or ourselves, when we are reviled for the sake of His name.

Exactly what

I remember what my old Sunday School teacher told me. It was something along the lines of, "Even if you are scorned in speaking to someone about Christianity, at least you have planted a seed in their hearts, which may be watered by someone else in a later point in time."

In 2 Timothy, it says to avoid worthless word battles, referring to arguments within the Church, but applicable to non-believers as well, and Jesus said "Don't give spiritual things to dogs, and don't throw pearls to swine." We need to tell the truth, but we can't argue it with them. If they honestly choose to ignore the Truth, then we cannot convince them with arguments and reason, because they will not be open to it. Also, if we convince them with "weapons of this world" such as our own human reasoning, then have they really accepted? Only God can prepare their heart, and only they have the choice to accept. We just do our part in the initiation, but it's not our place to fight the matter. If they reject, we shake the dust off our feet and move on. That doesn't mean we no longer show them love, however our witness is verbal once (unless they ask for more), but by example forever.

EireWolf wrote:Jesus didn't feel the need to defend Himself when He was unjustly reviled. I don't think we should feel the need to defend Him either... or ourselves, when we are reviled for the sake of His name.

"While Paul was waiting for them in Athens, he was greatly distressed to see that the city was full of idols. So he reasoned in the synagogue with the Jews and the God-fearing Greeks, as well as in the marketplace day by day with those who happened to be there" (Acts 17:16-17).

"Who is going to harm you if you are eager to do good? But even if you should suffer for what is right, you are blessed. 'Do not fear what they fear]http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0801062225/qid=1077806718/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/102-1952620-1702556?v=glance&s=books[/url]

"Reasonably Faith: Christian Truth and Apologetics," by William Lane Craig
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0891077642/qid=1077806774/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/102-1952620-1702556?v=glance&s=books

"When Skeptics Ask: A Handbook of Christian Evidence," by Norman Geisler
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0801011418/qid=1077806818/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/102-1952620-1702556?v=glance&s=books

There are many more, but those will give you a good foundation for further study in specific subjects.