CAA: Christian Anime Alliance

I find it interesting. Today at work, a customer (who I assume is Christian, of some sort) asked how we've been selling the Golden Compass video games. She asked if I knew the truth about it off Snopes and stuff about the killing God thing' and I said yes. I then mentioned how it's 'an atheist who wanted to form his opinion in a book', as a neutral statement. She said something about 'devil-worshipers' (referring to the nature of the book) and then went on to comment on my statement by saying 'don't you know what atheists are?'

After a bit of thought, I started to wonder: are there really Christians that believe that atheists are so-called 'devil worshipers?' I know for some people, the word 'Christian' and even 'religion' has such bad connatations to it (and I actually prefer to use the word 'belief' to 'religion', since 'religion' has such negative connotations to it), but to some of us, does 'atheist' sound like such a negative word? I know I've seen some 'Christian' websites referring to atheists as not nice things. Almost a word that you would use to a child when telling a scary story, while wiggling your fingers and widening your eyes saying 'aThEiSts... ooOOOOOooooo....' (if you can even picture it at all^^)

I'm just curious on this, if there really are people that believe it :/ I mean, as far as I'm concerned the only kind of 'devil worshiper' is a Satanist.

I agree, because technically, Atheists don't worship anything. It's what they pride themselves on.

Tenshi no Ai wrote:I mean, as far as I'm concerned the only kind of 'devil worshiper' is a Satanist.

Er, that's not entirely true. Satanists don't believe in the literal Satan of the Bible, or at least, the majority of them don't. They believe Satan is simply symbolic for man's inner desires.

Now, to be sure, there ARE what are called "theistic Satanists" which believe that everything in the Bible is true, and that Satan is correct in his rebellion against God, and follow him.

However there are even two sides to this, with one faction believing Satan is actually the embodiment of good and that God is a facist dictator, stating "Any worthwhile God would rather have a Partner-in-Power than a prostrate and grovelling slave." There is of course the other faction that believes God is good and Satan is evil, and choose to follow evil.

Anyway, my original point is, not all Satanists literally worship Satan. Many of them don't believe Satan even exists except in a symbolic sense.

Also, to answer your original question, no, atheists are not devil-worshipers.

I don't think atheists can worship anything (even though they really do.) But if your cause isn't for God, then who is it for?

It truly makes me laugh to hear something like that... I mean... we Christians are REALLY good at alienating people... which only makes things worse for us, and for those who we are alienating...

I mean, like it or not, Atheists are people just like us...they are sinners just like us, and they need Jesus' love...wow.. JUST like us.

I dont believe they are devil-worshipers...and it kinda makes me raise an eyebrow at anyone who thinks they are...:/

I am not trying to down our own faith or anything, but...maybe we shoud stop with the finger pointing and the labels...I mean we don't like it when we get labled... We should be LOVING those who hate us...instead of pointing fingers and being so quick to judge...

And I don't like the word 'religion' either XD To me, Christianity is more than that...

but thats just my two pennies that I threw into the bowl. >.> sorry if it's off topic...

Nate wrote:
Also, to answer your original question, no, atheists are not devil-worshipers.

Sort of a discussion question sort of thing on it, not really me asking the question. As far as I'm concerned, some people probably believe those who purposely do sinful things are 'devil-worshipers' but use the word 'worship' as such a heavy thing. It's just interesting.

People who think atheists are devil worshipers are just ignorant.

It's said that all atheists hate is merely a charicature (sp?) of God that they've been taught. So they rebel because of this. They are merely uninformed about the true nature of God.

Shao Feng-Li wrote:But if your cause isn't for God, then who is it for?

Themselves. Satan isn't behind every single evil act in the world. Humans have an inherent sin nature after all, and atheists are simply in it for their own selfish desires.

So they rebel because of this. They are merely uninformed about the true nature of God.

Untrue. Many atheists rebel because they find God to be a fairy tale or a lie created by churches to get money.

Many atheists also become atheists after going to church for years, so "the true nature of God" has little if anything to do with it. Besides, if they don't think God exists, how would they believe Him to have a true nature? It's like me stating what the diet of invisible pink unicorns is...if you don't believe in them, would it matter if I said you were misinformed about what they eat?

I don't think atheist are devil-worshipers per say,
but fact that they turn their backs on God and deny His existence is just what satan wants them to do. hmm...

I don't think they are, however, just as others have said, if you are not for God, you are against Him. Therefore, whether they believe it or not, they are on Satan's side. In my opinion there is no big difference between wanting for ourselves or what Satan wants. They are both sinful and evil in God's eyes. That's why when you become a Christian it's important to put God first, because putting ourselves first is just as bad as putting an idol first, satan first, or just plain ignoring the fact that God exists.

Nate wrote:Now, to be sure, there ARE what are called "theistic Satanists" which believe that everything in the Bible is true, and that Satan is correct in his rebellion against God, and follow him.

This always struck me like betting money on the Washington Generals.

I don't equate it in that fashion since my atheist friends don't worship some 'Devil' figure. They pretty much just believe in themselves and don't think God exists significantly enough to impact their lives.

bakura_fan wrote:I don't think they are, however, just as others have said, if you are not for God, you are against Him. Therefore, whether they believe it or not, they are on Satan's side.

I still disagree with this. There are atheists out there who, though they don't believe in God or think Christianity is correct, support those who do believe it. There are atheists who donate to Christian charities and whatnot, believing it to be good moral guidance and a source of inner strength, regardless of how they feel about the truth of it. I would not qualify that as being on Satan's side.

Now. Will such feelings save them? No, of course not, and even if they are "good" people by society's standards, they are of course still sinful in God's eyes, and it will not get them into Heaven. But to simply say that anyone who isn't a Christian is on "Satan's side" is ludicrous.

Nate wrote:I still disagree with this. There are atheists out there who, though they don't believe in God or think Christianity is correct, support those who do believe it. There are atheists who donate to Christian charities and whatnot, believing it to be good moral guidance and a source of inner strength, regardless of how they feel about the truth of it. I would not qualify that as being on Satan's side.

Now. Will such feelings save them? No, of course not, and even if they are "good" people by society's standards, they are of course still sinful in God's eyes, and it will not get them into Heaven. But to simply say that anyone who isn't a Christian is on "Satan's side" is ludicrous.

The Bible says that there are only two masters. God, and Satan. If you are not serving God, then you serve Satan. Even Christians can be on Satan's side at one point or another because of our sinful nature. When we put ourselves before Him, or when we run and ignore what God is telling us to do. Do we mean to be on Satan's side at those times? Of course not. That's why after we have done those things we turn to God and ask for His forgiveness. That's all that separates us from anyone else. Is that we believe there is a God, and that we need Him to purify us from our sins with Jesus blood.

bakura_fan wrote:The Bible says that there are only two masters. God, and Satan.

Verse for proof please? The only place in the Bible I remember Jesus talking about two masters was when He was saying one cannot serve both God and Money. Satan wasn't mentioned in there at all...and since money is hardly satanic (though the love of it is the root of all evil), by Jesus' words here we can assume that people have masters other than Satan. Again, this will not save them, but it in no way makes them on Satan's side.

Also again, if they were truly serving Satan, would they donate money to Christian charities or support Christian youth groups despite their atheism? That's not something Satan would want to have them do.

there are verses all over the place, Nate...Although I agree with both of you on this point...it's kinda hard to judge it black and white...there are so many ways to interpret verses.


Revelation 3:15-16

15I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either one or the other! 16So, because you are lukewarm—neither hot nor cold—I am about to spit you out of my mouth

James 4: 4-10 ( the word "world" is used here, but I think it alludes to Satan as well)

4You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God. 5Or do you think Scripture says without reason that the spirit he caused to live in us envies intensely?[a] 6But he gives us more grace. That is why Scripture says:
"God opposes the proud
but gives grace to the humble."[b]
7Submit yourselves, then, to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you. 8Come near to God and he will come near to you. Wash your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded. 9Grieve, mourn and wail. Change your laughter to mourning and your joy to gloom. 10Humble yourselves before the Lord, and he will lift you up.

I am sure I can dig up a few more XD but that's a start..

I will say this: I am not the sort of person to automatically give credit to Satan for a lot of things we do that is sinful... I sorta roll my eyes when people say "This is Satan at work here." How do you know?

I need to find the verse, but in James it says that it is because of our OWN sinful desires that we do things... and in Ephesians it says our battle is against the dark forces of this world. So our battle is against both! not JUST Satan.. stop giving that idiot the credit for our own faults... I am sure he enjoys taking the credit more than we realize.

FOund the verses:

James 1:14-15

14but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed. 15Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death.

Very well then, I stand corrected.

However, I think we can all agree that even if atheists are indeed on Satan's side, that doesn't mean they worship him (especially since if they are atheist, they wouldn't believe he exists).

Nate wrote:Very well then, I stand corrected.

However, I think we can all agree that even if atheists are indeed on Satan's side, that doesn't mean they worship him (especially since if they are atheist, they wouldn't believe he exists).

I agree. I never was meaning that everything we do is Satan's work. We are sinful in our own nature. So I apologize if anyone thought that was what I was saying.

Nate wrote:Very well then, I stand corrected.

However, I think we can all agree that even if atheists are indeed on Satan's side, that doesn't mean they worship him (especially since if they are atheist, they wouldn't believe he exists).

Tough call... :/ One one hand...I think the others are right when they say if they aren't for God, who are they for? There is no grey area.
They might not outrightly worship Satan... but they are probably "pawns" maybe? I hate using that word...it sounds so...strange..

Its like by the very choice of not believe in God, they choose to follow something they don't even beileve exists...which is, like the others have said, exactly what Satan wants.. (I am not saying he caused it..or anything...)

I don't think that Satan cares who people believe in...as long as it's not God. You know what I mean?

From reading Philip Pullman's own website I would classify him more as an Agnostic than a real Atheist as he himself says he isn't certain wheter or not a God exists.That is something that is more in line with being an
agnostic.

As far as it goes there are as many different types of atheists as there are Christians or any other type of Religionist.Some do hate the very concept of God while others do not find any clear evidence that would convince them that a God or Gods exist.

Let's not end up lumping them all in the same basket though.

And,as far as it goes atheists don't believe in a personal devil either,so why would they be misrepresented as worshipping someone they don't even accept as a reality?

I certainly don't believe that atheists are devil worshippers .
Yep, there really a lot more Christians who believe this.

And I agree with mitsuki.

Some Christians, unfortunately, are just like that. They label people without really knowing what they're talking about. There are Christians out there who think that dancing is evil, or that buying yourself a new car is evil.

Hopefully a new angle on this: more people than you would think possible actually don't know what an atheist is. Hence the word becomes a catchall for the "heathen." A classic story on this note comes from Julia Sweeney; after her parents learned that she had become an atheist, they responded "Not believing in God we could understand, but an atheist! An atheist?"

uc pseudonym wrote:"Not believing in God we could understand, but an atheist! An atheist?"

Yeah exactly, it's like a word that sounds like it could almost mean a cult or something.

...Julia Sweeny is both man and woman. Let the parents figure that one out :p

And that's why people should take the time to look things up. >>;; Unfortunately, many don't want to.

The Lord's word clearly states that there is no middle ground and that you are either for God or for Satan(Lucifer).

"Not believing in God we could understand, but an atheist! An atheist?"

I think this kinda goes into the grounds of "Greater wong doings.." But it doesnt matter... being an athiest is no worse than being another religion..its all the same.

And...heathen is such...a strange word...it doesn't match with today's vernacular does it? Why cant we just say non-christians? XD It sounds a lot less "holier than thou."

Which is what a lot of Christians today are so guilty of being...>_>

ChristianKitsune wrote:I think this kinda goes into the grounds of "Greater wong doings.." But it doesnt matter... being an athiest is no worse than being another religion..its all the same.

And...heathen is such...a strange word...it doesn't match with today's vernacular does it? Why cant we just say non-christians? XD It sounds a lot less "holier than thou."

Which is what a lot of Christians today are so guilty of being...>_>

I second that.

It may be of some importance to note that atheists, while they don't believe in the existence of God or Satan (well, those who truly are atheists, anyway), nonetheless can have opinions on who they hold to be fictional characters... just as you or I can have opinions on anime characters.

I don't think that many people would find the term "Superman-worshipper" to be that strange - a term like that could be applied to a person who loves the fictional character of Superman, and collects any merchandise carrying his likeness and/or logo religiously.

Likewise, there are some atheists who may love what they view as the character of Satan, and/or hate what they view as the character of God. I can certainly see how someone could come to the conclussion that a fiction writer who writes a story that includes "God" in the antagonist role and getting killed is a Satan-worshipper. Certainly, there's a certain hatred for God (as He's presented by certain world religions, if not God as we know Him personally) being displayed there, in my opinion.

However, a true atheist can't worship the devil in the sense that a Christian worships God.